Entertainment Series 4: Jon Devore / Aerial Stuntman / Coordinator

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Welcome to another episode of
Come Together.

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Thanks, Josh Devore.
You got it just in time.

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Thanks so much for coming.
I was like Jon Devore.

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Jon Devore.
Jon Devore, welcome man.

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I'm so happy that you came.
This is so dude, your website

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may make you look at the coolest
person in the entire world.

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Yeah, I think that was that was
great because just a little bit

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of context for how I found you.
I've always loved entertainment

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world and I've always loved not
just consuming it, but

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understanding how things happen.
You know what, what pieces have

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to fall into place in order to
make the magic happen.

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And, and as I started doing the
podcast, I started talking to

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more and more people.
I realized how important

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stuntmen work, stunt stunt work
is, you know, And so I've made

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it.
So I, so I asked chat TVT, give

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me a list of, of, you know, some
people that do different types

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of stunts, whether it's, you
know, martial arts or aerial or,

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you know, whatever it was.
And so, so you're one of the,

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one of the people that popped up
and, and thank you so much for

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making the time.
I appreciate it.

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Nice, good to hear chat knows
me.

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There you go.
Well, I mean I think it works in

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the same thing as Google, right?
Yeah, similar.

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Data, right.
So, so John, you're so I wanted,

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there's a bunch of different
topics I wanted to kind of talk

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to you about your thoughts on.
I wanted to start actually with

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the fact that you're from
Alaska, which I feel like is not

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too common over here, you know,
in the.

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Yeah.
Domestic quarter million people

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there, so, yeah.
Something like that.

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How'd you, how'd your family end
up there?

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What, what were you born there?
What was that like?

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I was actually born in Colorado,
but as a baby my parents moved

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to Alaska.
So it was a very Long story

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short on that one.
Was my, my grandfather on my

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mom's side had an early age
heart attack.

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And when he got better, his
wife, my grandma asked like,

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what do you want to do?
You know, one of those like,

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let's change our lives.
And he said, I want to go be a

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commercial fisherman in Alaska
because he liked, you know,

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fishing, but in Colorado.
So they packed their bags and

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they moved to Alaska within a
year or two of them being there.

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I'd probably tell the story a
little wrong because I was only

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a baby.
But within moments of time, my

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parents went to visit and they
did what what happened to them

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happens to a lot of people that
moved there is when they showed

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up, it was summertime and they
had two weeks of beautiful

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weather and my dad went out
fishing, caught king salmon like

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life couldn't have been better.
So they then went home and they

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were a young, young couple
starting a family.

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Dad has an engineering company,
you know, just starting though.

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But so they sold all that and
followed my mom's parents to

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Alaska and chased the Alaska
dream, which I couldn't be

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happier than they did because
growing up there, you know, I

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feel like I was born there
because that's all I remember

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because I was a baby.
But growing up there, I just

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feel insanely blessed, you know,
it's the opportunities that

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Alaska gives you everywhere from
spiritually, physically,

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everything you do there is a,
it's a really special place

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compared to most places in the
world.

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So I couldn't be happier that I
grew up there.

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That's so cool.
So I only spoke to one other

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gentleman in my life that
actually, that's not true.

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I've done some business in
Alaska.

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I've sold some.
I saw, I saw medical equipment.

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I've sold some equipment in like
Anchorage or you know, to

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veterinary hospitals in the
area.

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But I, I had a buddy of mine
that played basketball in Alaska

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for for a year.
He was in Vegas for his

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profession, his college career,
and then transferred to Alaska

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for a year.
And one of the things that he

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talked about, he goes, he told
me that other than the fact

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obviously that it's Alaska, he
said that the that socially and

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culturally people are far more
trusting of one another because

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it's a much more dangerous and
small environment or.

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You know, I guess you have to
depend on your neighbor.

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Yeah.
Correct.

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And he's like, you know,
hitchhiking.

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He's like, if you don't pick up
a hitchhiker, that person could

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be dead, you know, I mean,
within hours and you know, and

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so you know, I but but what
spiritually, what did you what,

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what, what do you feel is
different about Alaska than the

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rest?
Of I just mean, you know, it was

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just a choice of words.
But for me, it the way it put me

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in touch with nature and
solidified as a young kid that I

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knew that I needed to do
something different than sit in

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an office and just do the normal
adult life.

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You know, it's being out and
about in Alaska.

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You either get outside and play
in the elements where you stay

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inside, get cabin fever, go
crazy and can't wait to move.

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Yeah.
There's really not a middle

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point.
Yeah.

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And obviously, as a kid, I was
the kid that was always outside

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searching for adventure.
And so everywhere from being in

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touch with, you know, the
empathetic parts of the, you

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know, the human psyche of, you
know, caring for animals and

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nature and the forests and just
Mother Earth, you know, I don't

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feel like, you know, truth be
told, I don't really feel like

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I'm giving that to my kids,
raising them in Southern

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California, where I live now.
I was going to ask about that.

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Yeah.
So it's, you know, I have, I

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have to live where I live for
what I do, but sure.

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But yeah, I feel a little bit
like I, you know, gypsy kids out

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of an experience because of
that.

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I totally gotcha.
I totally gotcha.

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I mean, it's funny because I
grew up I I'm I'm trying to

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deviate my mentality.
I grew up in with, with, with

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from the rat race, you know, and
I'm trying so hard to find a

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balance of living a life that's
meaningful as as opposed to a

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life that is material, you know,
and searching for things that

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just pay the bill, you know,
like bills need to get paid, you

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know, but you got to have some
kind of sense of spiritual

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emotional satisfaction, you
know, natural satisfaction as

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well.
Yeah.

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Yeah.
Which is actually one of the

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reasons I moved.
I mean, it's funny because it

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doesn't sound like it,
especially coming from Alaska.

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I lived in Seattle for a little
while.

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That was amazing.
Oh yeah, it's saving Northwest.

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It's.
Almost.

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Oh man, oh man.
And I went to actually, I'm so

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happy I did this.
My roommate dragged me to the

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Cascades, the National, the
National Park by Lake Diablo

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area, and I was just like, I
didn't even know that this kind

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of stuff existed in America, you
know?

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I was like, this is incredible.
Yeah, no, I love Seattle area,

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man.
That's that's where that's where

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my family lives now, everybody
that retires.

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Oh yeah.
Alaska, they usually they don't

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get much further than Washington
or Oregon.

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Yeah, they still, they still
want that PNW feel, but.

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Yeah, I told you guys, it's
funny because I've, I've spoken

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to, it's a lot of people,
whether it's store owners or

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Uber drivers or whatever that
told me over the course of my

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time in Seattle.
They're like everyone comes, he

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goes.
If you get people at the right

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time, like what you said about
Alaska, the right time of year,

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you know, for like 4 or five
good months.

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There's something about Seattle
that just stays with people that

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actually keeps on calling them
back and keeps on bringing them

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back.
And he goes, you wouldn't be,

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you'd be surprised how many
people come for vacation and

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just end up moving there because
it's so beautiful.

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Yeah.
So you grew up in nature.

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You grew up a little bit, you
know, completely separated by,

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you know, with and, and really
in the midst of it.

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How did you, were you always a
risky type of kid?

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Were you always athletic?
Were you always.

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Yeah, that kind of kid.
Yeah, pretty much.

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You know, especially if you ask
my parents or something, It's

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yeah.
Every time.

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I started skiing as soon as I
could.

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I think I was like 4-4 or five
when I started skiing.

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I was just always outside, you
know, as a, as a young kid when

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I was like, well, I was like 14
or 15.

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Got certified to scuba dive, ski
and rock climbing.

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I was a river raft guy.
Do you name?

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It.
You know, mountain biking, the

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whole thing, I just love being
outdoors and all the way from

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camping to the extreme stuff.
It's it's what?

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So how So what?
So what?

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How'd you make that transition?
Did you always know that you

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were going to do something like
this?

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Or how did you start getting
involved in professional stunt

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and and you know, and aerial
work?

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Yeah, it's a it's a funny story,
I guess.

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But so when I was a senior in
high school, I basically wrote a

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paper.
I had a dream that I wanted to

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invent my own.
I'll back up.

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I worked for a river raft
company in the summer and I saw,

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you know, there's so many cruise
ships that come in every day.

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And I watch people get very
successful financially by

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figuring out how to tap into
tourism.

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So I knowing that I wanted to be
outside, I wanted to open my own

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adventure tourism company.
I wanted to call it Choose Your

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Own adventure.
Kind of like the books you read

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as a kid or you get to the end
of a chapter and you have to

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decide where to go.
I was going to build a company

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that people really didn't know
what was coming at them and they

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had to choose their next.
That's so cool.

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That's so much fun.
So as a senior in high school, a

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guy randomly came through our
town offering tandem skydiving

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and it was the first time it was
ever in our town.

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And I was this first guy that
signed up.

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My funny story is I had a fake
ID, the only way I could jump

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because I was too young to jump.
OK, so I did a jump, realized I

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loved skydiving.
It had no idea like how to get

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into it.
It didn't exist in Alaska.

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But I knew that I wanted to
offer a tandem skydiving as part

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of my adventure tourism package.
So I quickly, you know, was

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skipping a little bit of the
story.

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I realized that OK, I need 500
skydives to get my tandem

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license and then I can come back
home and take care of the rest

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of this stuff.
I can't, I can't imagine it's

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very cheap to do 500 dives
right?

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No, I mean there's a lot cheaper
back then when I did it in the

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early 90s compared to today,
it's a lot more.

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But but skydiving is not cheap.
But it's like any sport, it's

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once you get through the
certification and once you buy

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the gear, then it's not too bad.
Like a day of skydiving without

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breaking down the numbers would
be like a day of skiing.

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OK, gotcha.
Once you buy your ski gear and

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you got your lift ticket, you
know it's you go.

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So it's it is expensive, but I
worked really hard.

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I worked at a million different
jobs, got paid pretty well as a

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kid because Alaska has a lot of
great opportunities.

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So I'd saved up a lot of money
that I thought I was going to

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use towards college.
But I chased a girlfriend out of

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high school to a small little
Community College in Texas just

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knowing that I needed to get my
basic business associates at a

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minimum.
Sure.

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So during that time.
Was that a culture shock going

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from Alaska to Texas?
Yeah, especially where I went, I

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could go into.
Which part of Texas were you in?

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It was like 2 hours out of
Dallas and a little town

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Navarro, Texas.
She went there because of some

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cheerleading program.
I went there just to follow my

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girlfriend and of.
Course, yeah.

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Not not go to school.
Yeah.

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But that first semester there
was also a skydive center

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somewhat close at Texas A&M.
And so I went and learned to

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skydive.
And then I realized by talking

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to people there, like, holy
crap, there's a there's a whole

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life in an industry here.
So semester one, I went back, I

225
00:10:59,680 --> 00:11:02,560
broke up with my girlfriend.
I packed my car and I went back

226
00:11:02,560 --> 00:11:07,160
to Alaska with the idea of
working one more stint at a big

227
00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,520
I had a job at a big silver mine
there that paid, you know, at

228
00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:12,800
the time I'm 18.
So when I call it paid adult

229
00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:15,280
money, it it paid really well.
Sure.

230
00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,440
So I worked there for like half
a year, saved up a a ton of

231
00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:22,000
money and then packed my bags
again and moved down to the

232
00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:24,960
largest skydiving center in the
world, which is in Eloyd,

233
00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,600
Arizona.
It's kind of little at Phoenix

234
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,080
and Tucson.
And when I rolled into the drop

235
00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:35,160
zone, I'd kind of I within one
or two weeks of being there, I

236
00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:36,960
realized one, I was at the right
spot.

237
00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,640
I kind of landed there on
accident, just knowing that it

238
00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,680
was a place that I could jump in
the winter sunny and it looked,

239
00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,640
it looked big in the magazines,
but I didn't know that I was

240
00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:48,720
going to the biggest place.
That was where the entire world

241
00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:51,800
went to train for all the
nationals and world meets.

242
00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:57,000
So it was a crazy scene for me.
And I quickly realized what was

243
00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,240
going on.
And that was there was in my

244
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:04,920
view, what I saw, what I saw the
snowboarding world do to skiing

245
00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:08,440
when it came into the ski world
in the beginning, something like

246
00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:10,720
that was happening in skydiving.
There was this whole new

247
00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:14,040
discipline being talked about.
People were trying to invent it

248
00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:15,920
but couldn't really figure out
how to do it yet.

249
00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,520
But there was this big momentum
and luckily.

250
00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:22,000
What was it leading up to?
What today is called free

251
00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,800
flying.
So vertical skydiving, It didn't

252
00:12:24,800 --> 00:12:26,480
exist then.
It was just people on your

253
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:29,080
bellies falling and building
formations.

254
00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:29,880
Gotcha.
Yeah.

255
00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:34,080
But there was this artistic kind
of, you know, group of people

256
00:12:34,080 --> 00:12:37,040
from all around the world, only
about 10 people that were pooled

257
00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,120
together trying to figure out
how to get off their bellies,

258
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:42,560
get vertical and stay together.
Yeah.

259
00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:44,360
Is that something that you
figure out how to do eventually?

260
00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:46,680
Yeah.
Well, I joined that group within

261
00:12:46,680 --> 00:12:49,840
that year of being there.
I quickly was in that group.

262
00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,400
And so I became, you know, I'm
rushing through a little bit of

263
00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:57,360
the story, But within the first
year I was already recognized

264
00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,160
because I spent so much money
jumping compared to most people.

265
00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:02,640
I was just, people thought I had
a trust fund or something

266
00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:04,960
because I was just there
throwing hundreds of dollars

267
00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:06,800
down a day just jumping.
Yeah.

268
00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:09,760
But it got me to a skill level
that I caught up to people that

269
00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,720
had been doing it for years
within a year because I did like

270
00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,440
1200 jumps my first year and.
That got.

271
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:20,280
Going fast, yeah.
I quickly became one of that

272
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,160
group that is considered to be
The Pioneers of free flying.

273
00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:27,000
We invented a whole new
discipline and especially in

274
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:29,680
that time of the sport before
there was vertical wind tunnels

275
00:13:29,680 --> 00:13:33,840
and things, people had to come
to drop zones and hire coaches

276
00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:35,480
to get good.
Right.

277
00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:39,480
What goes into that, if you
don't mind me asking?

278
00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:43,880
So can you break down, let's say
form when you're when you're

279
00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:46,360
jumping, right, when you have a
coach and you're and you're and

280
00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,600
you're and you're skydiving,
you're free or free flying which

281
00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,920
or either what what are the
things that people do that would

282
00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:54,960
be wrong or right or and.
Why?

283
00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:56,720
Well, really depends on what
skill level you're at.

284
00:13:56,720 --> 00:14:00,000
I mean, I, I've trained
everybody from super beginner

285
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,080
skydivers that are barely
jumping out on their bellies,

286
00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:06,800
getting stable and like, Oh my
God, I'm overwhelmed, to world

287
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,120
champion people that are just
trying to get a little bit

288
00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:12,880
better to go with the art.
Yeah.

289
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:14,600
So it really depends on where
you're at.

290
00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:18,680
So somebody like me as a coach,
I would meet you and assess

291
00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:21,000
where you're at.
And then it says me, I'm brand

292
00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,440
new, I've never done it before.
I'm just a huge.

293
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,520
I wouldn't start with you
because I would go go to your

294
00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:29,000
drop zone, go through the course
to get certified, OK.

295
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:32,240
And so within depending on how
aggressive you are, but it could

296
00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:34,960
be like a long four day weekend
if at a big drop zone.

297
00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:38,680
But if once you get 25 jumps
under your belt, the 1st 12 of

298
00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:42,080
which are with a coach and
they're holding you and really

299
00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:45,800
hands on the last 12 or you're
doing solos, but you're kind of

300
00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:48,520
getting comfortable.
But then after 25 jumps, you

301
00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:51,440
have an A license which allows
you to be a skydiver anywhere in

302
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:52,920
the world.
You have a little license.

303
00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,600
You're still a very new and
regulated skydiver.

304
00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,360
But sure.
So once you get to that stage, I

305
00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,800
would then probably not try to
like, you know, you have so much

306
00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:04,040
to learn still.
I could if you just really want

307
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:05,520
to hire me, I'd be like, I'll
take your money.

308
00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:09,600
But what you really should do is
go out and do a couple 100 jumps

309
00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:13,640
and just go explore, jump with
random people, learn how to fly.

310
00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,280
But once you get to a sticking
point, you'd come to me.

311
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:19,280
I would evaluate where you're at
skill wise.

312
00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,720
What's going good, what's going
bad, what are your bad habits.

313
00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:24,520
Just like racing a car ski.
So what would be?

314
00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:25,920
Yeah.
So what would be some examples

315
00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,400
of us say bad habits, for
example, like, you know,

316
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,560
something, I, I just started
rolling jiu jitsu recently, you

317
00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:35,200
know, and one terrible habit
that I have is that I keep my,

318
00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,440
my, my defaults is to have my
feet flat on the floor, my legs

319
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,640
flat on the floor.
And my, and every 30 seconds

320
00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:42,960
the, the, the coach is the
audience.

321
00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,600
Like pick your legs up, pick
your legs up, pick your, you

322
00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,600
know, and it's a natural bad
habit that I have to like re

323
00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:51,040
have to rewire and retrain my,
my muscle memory to kind of.

324
00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:54,480
So what are some things that I,
that people would do wrong or do

325
00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:55,840
do wrong?
And what would be the potential

326
00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:59,160
consequences or unless it's more
of a form in an art and a

327
00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,400
perfection kind of thing where
you're just like, this is just

328
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,280
the most.
It's really all the above, but

329
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:04,960
yeah, it's kind of all the
above.

330
00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:08,480
But to answer some of those
questions, it's basically like

331
00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,360
somebody that's coming to me.
Some of the initial bad habits

332
00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:16,440
that people go with was they
think that because you're in 120

333
00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,720
plus mile an hour winds, you
need to control the air and be

334
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:22,440
strong.
So everybody's super stiff and

335
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,280
rigid.
Where really skydiving is more

336
00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,840
like yoga.
You want to be really flexible

337
00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:29,800
and fluid.
You want to be strong enough to

338
00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:32,840
put your body where it needs to
be to deflect the wind and move

339
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:35,480
where you want to move.
But if you're using muscle,

340
00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,480
you're doing it wrong and you're
going to be like a 2 by 4 in the

341
00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:40,400
wind.
That's just like flipping

342
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,160
everywhere compared to being
fluid and absorbing.

343
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,720
So a habit of being like not
breathing enough, being super

344
00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,720
stiff and strong.
And then a lot of it is form of

345
00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:52,440
body.
Everybody finds a natural way

346
00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:54,840
where they think they need to
because they feel comfortable.

347
00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:58,080
Like my arms, I feel good here.
I feel good with my legs like

348
00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:00,000
this.
But it might be making a move

349
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,640
around the sky.
Sure.

350
00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,440
So kind of just like what you're
saying in in martial arts,

351
00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:08,160
breaking out the muscle memory
that is probably wrong in them.

352
00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:11,359
Yeah.
And retraining the muscle memory

353
00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:13,520
of what's right and why it's
right.

354
00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,480
So that's very beginner stuff.
And then as you get advanced,

355
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,760
it's much more of form,
technique and things of that

356
00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:21,240
nature.
It's hard to explain if you're

357
00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:22,440
not jumping.
I gotcha.

358
00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:24,200
Yeah, but that's I think that's
that's clear enough.

359
00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:28,400
So so you're so you're young,
you're you dropped out of

360
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:30,120
college.
You're probably in your late

361
00:17:30,120 --> 00:17:32,360
late teens, early 20s I imagine
right at this.

362
00:17:32,360 --> 00:17:34,440
Point I moved to you like when I
was 19, so.

363
00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:38,400
That's crazy.
So were you, Are you at this

364
00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:39,920
point?
First of all, when you said that

365
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:41,960
you packed your car, you drove
from Texas to Alaska.

366
00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:46,200
Well, I drove from Alaska to
Texas, drove back from Texas to

367
00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:49,440
Alaska to work again, and then I
drove back from Alaska to

368
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:50,440
Arizona.
Yeah.

369
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,080
I did because I did the drive
from New York to Seattle when I

370
00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:56,000
moved.
And then I was thinking about

371
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,160
driving to Alaska when I was
from there and I was like,

372
00:17:58,160 --> 00:17:59,640
that's a whole another trip from
New York.

373
00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:01,920
That's a that's a whole other
country that you have to drive

374
00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:03,680
up and down.
Alaska's way bigger than people

375
00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,880
think.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

376
00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,040
Wow.
So you and what'd your parents

377
00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:09,960
say about all this?
Or if did they have a say or

378
00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,760
they didn't?
I know they were super

379
00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:15,960
supportive.
I, you know, my parents, they

380
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,880
weren't adventurous sports
people at all like me, but

381
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:22,320
obviously they had a sense of
adventure in their spirit to

382
00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,040
pack their bags as young parents
and move to Alaska.

383
00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:27,160
Sure.
So they, and they also, you

384
00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:29,880
know, grew up in the 60s.
They, you know, call them like a

385
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:31,480
hippie mindset.
Gotcha.

386
00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:34,320
Where their biggest thing was
they just, they wanted to have a

387
00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:36,400
sister.
They wanted us to just pursue

388
00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:40,040
whatever we were happy doing.
It wasn't about chasing like you

389
00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:42,920
need to be a lawyer, a doctor,
you know, you don't have to

390
00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:44,560
chase the money.
You got to chase happiness

391
00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:46,600
because that's in the end what
it's all about.

392
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,640
So they, they saw I was happy.
They saw I was doing what I was

393
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:53,720
loving to do.
So they were scared of what I

394
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:54,280
was doing.
But.

395
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:57,480
It sounds great.
It sounds scary like and I guess

396
00:18:58,120 --> 00:19:01,680
and very, very few accidents
happen or or or serious accident

397
00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:05,120
injuries happen relatively
speaking while I'm skydiving,

398
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:06,360
right?
That's pretty.

399
00:19:06,360 --> 00:19:06,680
Much.
Yeah.

400
00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:10,680
I mean, it's it's insane how
little true skydive accidents

401
00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,040
happen.
I would say, and I'm making up a

402
00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,640
number, but I know I'm really
close to like 90% of all

403
00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:18,080
accidents skydiving.
Or when you're under a perfectly

404
00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:21,960
good parachute and you do a
pilot error, like you fly a bat

405
00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:23,920
into the ground or something
like that.

406
00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:27,360
But in free fall and stuff, the
gear we have everywhere from

407
00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:30,200
little computers that pull for
you, you have say for some

408
00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:32,960
reason you were either being an
airhead and you didn't even know

409
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:34,560
what altitude you're at or
you're.

410
00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:36,080
On coaches or.
Everywhere.

411
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:38,960
So it doesn't even need us to do
that that that manual, that

412
00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:40,520
manual.
I mean you really need to, but

413
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,720
there is a automatic opening
device that will save your life

414
00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:45,840
if you're about to go in for
sure.

415
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:48,240
Gotcha.
OK, so you're young and you're

416
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:50,520
getting and you're doing this
now.

417
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:58,000
Are you into Did you get into
the stunt world because you're a

418
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,560
film fan or because you're.
Sports fan like you know.

419
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,160
A little bit of both, yeah.
Yeah, a little bit of both.

420
00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:10,040
So when I say like year one ish,
2:00-ish on the drop zone, when

421
00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:12,040
I really realized I wanted to
try to figure out how to do this

422
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:16,000
with my life, I kind of surveyed
the landscape of professional

423
00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:18,240
skydivers.
And I realized there's only a

424
00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:22,520
few people that like I said, OK,
who's fifty 60s and has been

425
00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,760
doing this.
And I realized it was either the

426
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,080
world champion type skydivers
that had all the coaching and

427
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:33,280
festivals and people booking
their time and it was

428
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,760
professional camera Flyers that
could put stills or cameras on

429
00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:38,720
their head and get hired to do
that work.

430
00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:42,600
Yeah.
Yeah, or it was people that

431
00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,000
figured out how to break into
the stunt world, which was

432
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:48,160
obviously the most guarded
because there was really like 3

433
00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:51,040
or 4 people and they got all the
jobs and it never went anywhere

434
00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:53,480
else, right?
So I kind of had a goal and I

435
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:56,480
did it in stair stepping, Become
a world champion, learn how to

436
00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:00,400
fly cameras and look for
opportunities to break into the

437
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:03,160
stunt world.
Once my skill and, you know,

438
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:06,640
expertise was to that level.
And so I was just kind of always

439
00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:09,000
having that in my mind that that
was a goal of mine and chasing

440
00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:10,600
it.
That's really cool.

441
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:13,320
And it's really cool how you
thought of that plan because I

442
00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:14,880
feel like I would have thought
of it backwards.

443
00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,280
I would have figured out like I
would have wanted to, wanted to

444
00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:19,120
do the stunts and like, how do I
get there?

445
00:21:19,360 --> 00:21:21,240
But it sounds like, I mean, but
it seems like you were going

446
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:23,760
more about the perfection of the
art, or at least trying to

447
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,760
really get to know the.
Art yeah, the first decade of my

448
00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,400
career was I was wow cool and
at.

449
00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:31,440
That point, you were living in
Arizona the whole time.

450
00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:36,080
No, I did a couple years in
Arizona and then I moved out to

451
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,400
Florida to open the IT was
called the first school of

452
00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,200
modern sky flying, but the first
free fly school on the East

453
00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:44,760
Coast.
So far it was just the West

454
00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:47,000
Coast.
So I moved out to Florida for a

455
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,840
few years and eventually moved
back to help some buddies open a

456
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:52,840
drop zone in Lake Tahoe,
California.

457
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:57,880
Wow, given some about here.
Oh yeah, yes.

458
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,280
There's these are these are
these are fun places to hang

459
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:01,480
out.
These are outside.

460
00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:04,840
You know, it's funny when I
whenever I travel to anywhere, I

461
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:08,760
asked Google ChatGPT what the
least touristy places for me to

462
00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:11,760
go find that or feel like the
most authentic to have their own

463
00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:15,440
kind of like I don't want to go
to places that the that where

464
00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:17,400
the locals are trying to cater
to tourists.

465
00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,720
I want to go to the places where
the locals are themselves and I

466
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,120
get to just see what that's like
a little bit.

467
00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:25,200
And I feel like the place that
you're going is like America,

468
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:28,840
America, you know, like people
trying to be what America is

469
00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,160
perceived at.
But like, you know, people

470
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:32,800
really just mind their own
business and doing their own

471
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:34,400
things and living their own
lives and doing their own

472
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:36,840
hobbies and passions, you know,
It's really, really cool.

473
00:22:37,360 --> 00:22:39,080
Yeah.
So what was it like?

474
00:22:39,120 --> 00:22:43,160
So, so opening the flight school
in Florida, what's the process

475
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:44,520
for that?
Did you have, is it crazy

476
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,720
regulations, crazy insurance?
Is it that is it a million

477
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,600
different, you know, red tapes
of bureaucracy?

478
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:51,720
None of the above.
Really.

479
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:54,400
No, I mean it was pretty simple.
The Skydive World the.

480
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:56,280
Skydive World is a pretty simple
place.

481
00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:58,440
Well, it's just the skydive
world period.

482
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,800
It's you know that to answer
that just very matter of fact,

483
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,640
it's I made a deal with the
skydive center that was in

484
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,360
Florida and they were happy to
receive me and my teammates to

485
00:23:08,360 --> 00:23:10,680
move out there and open a school
and create a scene.

486
00:23:11,360 --> 00:23:12,560
Cool.
It's just making a deal with the

487
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:16,120
local Scott Ivan place.
And yes, the adult me looking

488
00:23:16,120 --> 00:23:18,520
back should have done those
things you said to protect

489
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,560
myself, but as a young 20
something year old, you don't

490
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:23,160
care.
You're just like I'm sponsored

491
00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:25,560
to the drop zone.
I'm jumping all day and I'm I'm

492
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:28,480
running a school.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

493
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:30,560
Pretty crazy.
It's pretty pretty carefree.

494
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,360
Yeah, yeah.
And now and now I I saw that

495
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:38,200
this year that stunts are
officially, officially on the

496
00:23:38,360 --> 00:23:41,880
was it the Emmy or the the
there's some Oscars.

497
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,360
The Oscars, Yeah.
So people can be can be

498
00:23:44,360 --> 00:23:47,080
nominated for for stunts now.
That's awesome.

499
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,720
It's it's it's good to get.
That, yeah, it's still, it's a

500
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,280
great, it's a great breakthrough
for sure.

501
00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:55,040
It's not exactly what it sounds
like, like a stuntman is not

502
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,000
going to get an award.
OK, but what is it A?

503
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,800
Coordinator could.
Which you could do too I.

504
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,400
Believe that the way I read it
is the What's that?

505
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:05,840
Which you can do as well, right?
You're a coordinator as well.

506
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:08,160
Yeah, yeah.
I just meant it's not that

507
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:10,760
you're not getting a reward for
best stunt or something.

508
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,240
Gotcha, gotcha.
But it's, it's definitely a,

509
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:17,680
we've been fighting since, you
know, before I was even thinking

510
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,360
about being a stuntman.
They've been fighting to make it

511
00:24:20,360 --> 00:24:23,240
into the world of Oscars and
stuff and finally did it.

512
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,320
Yeah, yeah, it's cool.
And it feels like it's, it

513
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:28,200
feels, it feels also like it's
kind of breaking a little bit

514
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:32,480
into the, into the zeitgeist,
you know, into the culture.

515
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:35,200
And it feels like, you know,
where there's a couple of movies

516
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,960
recently or just more
conversations based on it or or

517
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,520
stunt people turn to directors
or, you know, actors, which I

518
00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:43,400
feel, which, which is, I feel
like I've been reading about

519
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:47,160
more and more.
Yeah, like.

520
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,440
A fall guy movie.
Yeah, yeah.

521
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:51,640
And I believe.
That did a lot for it.

522
00:24:52,120 --> 00:24:56,120
Did you?
No, that that did a lot for.

523
00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,120
That did a lot for it.
Yes, yes, yes, definitely.

524
00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:02,880
And I believe that the director
of John Wick was also a stuntman

525
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:06,160
originally.
And and so when he when he was

526
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:09,160
bouncing around, you know, doing
the promotions for his movies,

527
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:10,280
he'll talk about that quite a
bit.

528
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,800
I remember, I remember hearing
that and thinking like this is

529
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:14,240
really this is, this is, this is
awesome.

530
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,640
What's the difference between?
How do you find the difference

531
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:19,760
in satisfaction between
coordinating and actually being

532
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:25,760
part of the part of the stunts?
I love both worlds.

533
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,040
For me, whether it's the world
of the Red Bull Air Force that I

534
00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,640
run or the world of Hollywood,
I've always been a fan of.

535
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,240
I kind of, I'm not the only one
that's done this, but kind of

536
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:39,000
broke the mold a little bit in a
lot of times it's either you're

537
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:42,000
one or the other.
But ever since I started getting

538
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:46,680
opportunities, I started kind of
pleading the case of because

539
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:52,000
it's such a specialty thing that
that aerial stunts, that is, I

540
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,680
always tried to fight to be the
aerial stunt coordinator, but

541
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,680
also a performer at the same
time.

542
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,680
That way I didn't have to get
feedback from my team and just

543
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,160
kind of trust what they're
saying.

544
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:05,880
I would have first hand
experience and knowledge of what

545
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:08,920
was going on in the scene.
So then as a coordinator, I

546
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:13,080
could make changes from, you
know, first hand POV, not just

547
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:18,480
talking to my team.
So for me, though, it's a the

548
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:22,040
big picture of coordinating and
seeing the, the very beginning

549
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,920
conversation, some random phone
call from a director all the way

550
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,080
to seeing it on the big screen.
It's an amazing feeling.

551
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,760
So I love the coordinating part
of it and all the way down to

552
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:34,280
the Red Bull world and a simple
sorry do.

553
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,400
You get input from the.
Do you work with the director as

554
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,520
a coordinator for for with
editor on different scenes?

555
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,280
Yeah.
Yeah, every movie is different.

556
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:46,640
Most of the time you're working
directly with the second unit

557
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:49,640
director, not the first unit
director.

558
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:52,480
But it depends on what movie it
is.

559
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,400
You know, say like the Mission
Impossible and I just did, you

560
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:59,240
know, I'm, I'm right next to
McHugh, the director, and, you

561
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:01,760
know, Tom and Wade Eastwood, the
second unit director.

562
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,640
So that's one where it's like
everybody's always collaborating

563
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,160
together.
Other ones, I've never even seen

564
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,080
an actor or a director.
And we just go on a skeleton

565
00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:14,080
unit and they're like, here's
the scene, here's the

566
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:15,640
storyboards.
Yeah.

567
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:18,920
So everyone is very different.
It depends on, I think, how

568
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:20,920
involved the scene is in the
movie.

569
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,200
Gotcha.
Yeah, I really, I was going to

570
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,840
say, I feel like the premise of
a lot of the, you know, Mission

571
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,720
Impossible type movies, the
premise is the action.

572
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,920
So I feel like you're, you know,
especially a lot of the big

573
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:33,840
aerial stunts that that they're
famous for.

574
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,640
I feel like you.
I feel like they would almost

575
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,040
need, you know, you know, at
least some kind.

576
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,240
Of they do for those, Yeah,
you're right, yeah.

577
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:42,840
Definitely.
What's What's that set?

578
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:44,240
What's that?
What's it like going to that

579
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,880
set?
It's, it's overwhelmingly

580
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,840
awesome.
You know, it's a there's a lot

581
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:55,120
going, there's a lot going on, a
lot of a lot of moving parts.

582
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:57,600
Does it feel like a?
City.

583
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,440
Does it feel like a town?
Does it feel like I mean like?

584
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:02,720
I mean every sets.
Yeah, go ahead.

585
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:05,560
Oh, does every sets very
different?

586
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,600
You know, you, you might go film
a scene that might even be a

587
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,920
massive scene in a movie and
it's just 20 people because

588
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:13,440
you're just trying to film a
thing.

589
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:18,360
Or you might show up and there's
250 people on set and it's, it's

590
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:20,320
a mini city, you know, like you
said.

591
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:24,360
So it's every, every time it's
different, but it's always,

592
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,480
that's what I like about it is a
diversity.

593
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,360
It's never rinse, repeat.
Yeah, every day is something

594
00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:31,840
new, different.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

595
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,280
I saw from I saw from the
credits that I saw from your

596
00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:37,880
credits that there was a pretty
cool variety in terms of

597
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,120
different size productions or
budgets or studios or even, you

598
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:44,720
know, the type of movies that
you know how, how, how stunt

599
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,720
focused they were going to be.
Right.

600
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:52,880
The unrideables did you What?
What, what is that?

601
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,200
That was so cool.
I I watched the trailer.

602
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:56,920
I didn't watch.
I didn't watch the movie.

603
00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:58,320
I have to.
I have to watch it.

604
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,200
I didn't have time since last
night, but I watched the trailer

605
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,200
for it and I was like, I
absolutely need to sit on my

606
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,840
couch and, and and and and watch
this all the way through.

607
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:08,880
It looks remarkable.
Yeah.

608
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,080
Can you ask one too?
So what?

609
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:13,600
Yeah.
So what the Unrideables, the

610
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:18,040
Alaska Range is, it's a
documentary that was with Red

611
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:21,560
Bull Media House.
And so basically to back up

612
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:25,200
before getting into the movie,
what the sport is, is somewhere

613
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:29,440
back in the early days,
skydivers started finding out

614
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,200
that if they jumped over
mountains and flew their faster

615
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,920
parachutes down mountains, it
was a lot of fun.

616
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,120
Paragliders were realizing
instead of just running off a

617
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,200
mountain and soaring on
thermals, that if they flew

618
00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:44,200
smaller wings and flew down
terrain, that was fun.

619
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:49,480
And so eventually the two sports
both kind of the same time start

620
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:53,600
figuring out, hey, in the
winter, if we put skis on, we

621
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:57,320
can easily like, get enough
speed to get a parachute over

622
00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:01,880
our head and then start flying.
And so it was basically a

623
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,840
combination of big mountain
skiing meets skydiving meets

624
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,880
paragliding.
And it was a really small group

625
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,360
of people, just like the small
group that invented free flying

626
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:13,760
when I started that had a vision
of like, hey, there's something

627
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,960
more than just like the Yahoo
backyard thing.

628
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,560
And so the sport started
developing.

629
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,200
And I was one of the early
people that started on the

630
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,400
skydive side that started going
to mountains because I grew up

631
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:30,120
skiing, so I love skiing.
So a group of us would go out

632
00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,720
and explore, you know, flying
parachutes down mountains with

633
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:36,320
skis on or with skis off in the
summer where you're running.

634
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,520
And so I pitched a Red Bull,
pitched a Red Bull years before

635
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:42,880
the movie.
Hey, I want to go to a project.

636
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:46,440
I want to go to Alaska, back to
my home and go fly some of the

637
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:49,000
biggest mountains that I used to
stare at as a kid.

638
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,280
But we're never skiable because
they closed in, like kuwars or

639
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:56,200
glaciers or cliffs.
So nobody's ever skied them.

640
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,400
But there's sections that look
amazing.

641
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:00,400
Yeah.
But now we have a sport that I

642
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:04,160
can go ski this area and in any
given moment, slide away from

643
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:05,880
it.
Yeah.

644
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,000
So at first, Red Bull's like,
what is this sport?

645
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:09,400
What?
Just kind of like what you're

646
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:10,720
doing.
Like I never even heard of this.

647
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,400
So at first they said no, love
the passion.

648
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:17,000
When they come back to it, no,
years later, I get a a phone

649
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:20,400
call from a marketing manager at
Red Bull that was in the that

650
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,520
Alaska regions.
Like, hey, I came across this

651
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,200
old proposal you pitched.
Do you still want to do this?

652
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:27,960
And to skip through a bunch of
that conversation, I was like,

653
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,560
hell yes, I do.
And so his vision was to blow it

654
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:32,960
up way bigger.
I just wanted to go on an

655
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,840
athlete project, but he wanted
to make a documentary about it

656
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:38,880
because by that time the sport
was getting traction.

657
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,560
There's people in Europe
starting to do it, America, all

658
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,400
around the world, small little
groups were doing it.

659
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,480
So what the film really is is
it's me and a few of my

660
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:52,280
teammates, But and it's the
story is told through my eyes,

661
00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:56,480
but it's not about me at all.
It's kind of a quick summary of

662
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,720
the history of speed riding and
how it came to be.

663
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,760
And they follow us on a fun
journey in Alaska to kind of

664
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,200
tell the story.
But we also go to Shamani,

665
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,720
France, because that's where
some of the real innovators were

666
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,400
pushing the limits and things of
that nature.

667
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,200
So it's the story of how this
weird sport speed line riding

668
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:19,400
came to life.
Wow, yeah, I remember watching

669
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:21,200
it.
I was watching it and I was just

670
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:25,440
like, I'm trying to comprehend
what's going on, what's going on

671
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:30,280
at one time and how like the
sport makes sense because I was

672
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,400
trying to figure out, is the
emphasis going to be on the, on

673
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:36,040
the, on the skiing or on the, on
the gliding, you know?

674
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,760
Flying, yeah.
And the flying, Yeah, and.

675
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,960
That's a little bit of both.
Everybody takes a different like

676
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,440
somebody like me that loves
skiing and I'm pretty good at

677
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,480
it.
The goal, the hardest part of

678
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,000
the sport is to stay on the
ground skiing.

679
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,600
But at the same time, while
you're skiing, you're flying a

680
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,960
wing that wants to screw up and
mess with you if you're not

681
00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:59,000
paying attention to it.
So the hardest part is the

682
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:02,280
riding, the speed riding part.
But a lot of people that aren't

683
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,120
that good at skiers want to go
fly big mountains and they

684
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,640
touchdown sometimes, but they're
mainly flying, then they touch

685
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,960
back down.
And so there's no exact recipe

686
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:15,680
of what's wrong or right, but it
allows people to explore big

687
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:19,640
mountain terrain with the safety
net of a parachute.

688
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,680
You know, So step one is you got
to know how to fly a parachute,

689
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:24,880
whether you're a skydiver or a
paraglider.

690
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:28,040
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So I guess so I guess the amount

691
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,520
of people that that that have
access to this sport is pretty

692
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,520
limited.
But I feel like, I feel like

693
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:36,600
it's also it's like it's
exploratory.

694
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,120
Like you could totally I I like
you like you mentioned earlier,

695
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:43,000
like these are places that you
never had any like no one ever

696
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:46,360
thought could be skeet, you
know, And so to kind of break

697
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:48,920
those grounds is is really
awesome.

698
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,360
Where else have you Where else
have you travelled to?

699
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:54,640
For for either purpose, for
skiing or for or for jumping.

700
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:57,440
Like globally?
I mean all over.

701
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:00,160
I've done a whole bunch of all
the different Alps in Europe,

702
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:06,600
you know, Italy, Switzerland,
France, Norway, New Zealand.

703
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,159
Any of these places stick out
for any particular reasons?

704
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,880
Well, this is 1 ski resort
called Valfres Juice France,

705
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:19,800
which is about an hour and a
half out of Tour in Italy, but

706
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:23,600
it's in France.
It's the Mecca for it because

707
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:27,480
that ski resort has adopted it
to the point where they've

708
00:34:27,639 --> 00:34:31,199
designated a massive part of
their mountain for speed riding

709
00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:33,320
only.
So there's a a great speed

710
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,679
riding, actually a couple, but a
great speed riding school there.

711
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,000
So whether you're somebody
that's never flown a wing in

712
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,880
your life or never skied, you'll
see people like that show up all

713
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,360
the way to people like
professional skydivers that want

714
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,880
to learn to do it better.
So it's a place you can go to

715
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:52,159
and learn how to do it and get
really good because you can just

716
00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:54,440
do laps because this ski resort
allows you to do it.

717
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:56,719
So you can go up a chairlift,
right when you get off the

718
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:00,200
chairlift, you launch your wing,
fly down, put it in a bag, get

719
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,960
back on the chairlift.
So just like skiing, so you can

720
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:04,720
really do a lot.
The eruption.

721
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:07,240
And every place.
What's that?

722
00:35:07,240 --> 00:35:08,520
You.
Get your reps in.

723
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:13,200
Yeah, and yeah, when it comes to
learning any sport, reps is

724
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:15,600
important.
So to get good at it, that's the

725
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:17,840
place that really stands out.
But then it when it comes to

726
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:20,880
pure thrills and what I really
love is there's nowhere like

727
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,040
Alaska.
It's some of the biggest terrain

728
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:26,240
in the world and it's just
really unique features and a

729
00:35:26,240 --> 00:35:28,360
special place in my heart, you
know?

730
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:33,080
But Norway was some of the
craziest, most dynamic big, you

731
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,960
know, in the fjords, the big
rock walls and stuff to fly

732
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,120
down.
You know, I got stories, stories

733
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:40,880
for days.
But it's a I've been.

734
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,800
Amazing, It's so cool.
It's so cool that you got it's

735
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,480
what's so cool to me is just
that a couple of these decisions

736
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,320
to make a couple of out of
out-of-the-box choices, you

737
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:54,280
know, led to you being it was
such it's it's such serendipity.

738
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:56,840
You know, as you give you the
pre to give you the opportunity

739
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,480
to even think that this is a
lifestyle that, that that you're

740
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:02,560
capable of living, You know, is
it, it is awesome.

741
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:05,000
I want I, I, I, I think, I think
about that a lot.

742
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,600
You know, how guys set my how
guys set my kids up in a way

743
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,200
that they're, they feel
encouraged to.

744
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:13,040
They got like a 2 1/2 year old
and a three month.

745
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,960
Old their passions.
Yeah, and I want them to be able

746
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:17,760
to like.
Live a life of tricky.

747
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,200
Folks, yeah, you know, but
without being a totally

748
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,320
irresponsible doofus, you know,
I think that there's a middle

749
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,080
ground.
It's a tough one there's.

750
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,480
Definitely a middle ground, but
I mean, it's how I tell people a

751
00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:32,840
lot that the first handful of
years of me chasing my dream, I

752
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:34,360
didn't care about the money
part.

753
00:36:34,720 --> 00:36:36,960
I wasn't trying to, I didn't
have a family.

754
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,760
I wasn't trying to like provide.
I didn't.

755
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:41,960
I just wanted to be able to do
what I was doing for free and

756
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:46,240
make enough to eat.
And my only goal was to do more

757
00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:48,320
of what I.
What you were doing, Yeah.

758
00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:51,000
And not everybody can do that.
A lot of people roll into life

759
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,160
and you have to pay rent, pay
bills, do all these things and

760
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,000
it's hard to be like, well, I
don't care if I make money or

761
00:36:57,000 --> 00:36:59,760
not, you know, So it's, it's not
easy for sure.

762
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,600
And I, there's definitely
moments in my young career where

763
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,840
I'm in an airplane climbing at
altitude and it's a beautiful

764
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,400
thing.
But I found myself thinking

765
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:09,960
like, Oh shit, what did I do
with my life?

766
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:14,760
Like I'm not making much money.
Like I'm having fun, but Oh my

767
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:17,120
God, like I'm getting all like,
what am I doing?

768
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,400
And then every time I kind of
luckily had those kind of

769
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,800
thoughts, some opportunities
would come my way within a few

770
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:27,400
weeks or months and kind of
remind myself why I'm doing it.

771
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:30,000
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I think a lot of life is like

772
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:31,320
that.
I think a lot of things, it's

773
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,800
almost like, you know when you
buy a car and then and then you

774
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:35,840
start seeing it everywhere on
the road and you never noticed

775
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:37,480
them beforehand.
Right.

776
00:37:37,720 --> 00:37:39,680
You know.
Exactly.

777
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,520
So I feel like also, you know,
there's been times in my life

778
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:45,320
where I'm like waiting for the
where's something, I realize

779
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:47,880
that something I, I either
something I'm looking for

780
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:51,760
something deeper or more, or,
you know, you know, there's a

781
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,680
better opportunity or something.
And by the time that thought

782
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,600
actually, actually like, starts
settling in my head and like

783
00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:01,720
with me, and it's to the front
of my consciousness, you know,

784
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,200
you keep an eye out for whatever
opportunity to kind of let that

785
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,960
let that happen.
Does technology and AI and stuff

786
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:15,160
like that scare you in terms of
the future of stunt work in

787
00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:18,480
general, especially with
studios, you know?

788
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:20,360
Yeah, being able to implement
it.

789
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,680
You have an accountant.
I see it a lot already.

790
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:27,680
Yeah.
I mean, I already see it a lot

791
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:32,040
already where, you know, like in
the stunt world they call it

792
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:37,040
doing it practical, like doing
it for real, you know, so you

793
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:40,320
find it, it's having a comeback
that doing stunts practical is

794
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,600
having a comeback.
There was definitely an era of

795
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:47,720
like way too much CGI going on
and you know, AI and all the all

796
00:38:47,720 --> 00:38:49,960
the computer graphics.
There's definitely a happy

797
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:51,360
medium.
Like any movie needs a little

798
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:54,680
bit of everything.
But you know, it's a, you know,

799
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:58,880
like say I did a movie, I did a
few rock movies, like just to

800
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,800
name one, like Rampage or San
Andreas, both of them.

801
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:06,160
I had to get a guy that was the
right size and shape, but it

802
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:07,520
didn't look anything like the
Rock.

803
00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:11,240
So they did face replacement and
that's a really simple example,

804
00:39:11,240 --> 00:39:14,920
but already they really didn't
need a certain, you know,

805
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:17,200
person.
They just needed a six foot four

806
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:21,240
guy, you know, stuff like that.
And then all the way to like the

807
00:39:21,240 --> 00:39:24,240
Transformers movie I did was
with Michael Bay way back in the

808
00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:25,640
day.
That was one of the early ones

809
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,560
where the first half of our
wingsuit scene flying through

810
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:32,440
Chicago was practical.
OK, you see in a in an instant,

811
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:34,960
the second CGI kicked in, you
can tell.

812
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:37,840
And it made the stunt feel like
OK with.

813
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:43,600
The Iron Man suit fake.
A lot of the Iron Man stuff, I

814
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:46,200
mean, a majority of that was
practical.

815
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:48,080
We shot almost everything
practical.

816
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:52,240
The CGI that was added on was
like making the suit look like

817
00:39:52,240 --> 00:39:54,320
we even had a suit, but it
didn't look anything like the

818
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,160
one you see in a movie in the
sense of shiny and this and

819
00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:59,320
that.
So they went in and dressed that

820
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,960
up, make it look good.
Put in boosters like that, that

821
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:05,920
kind of look.
But you know the the guy I had

822
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:08,240
the Iron Man was in an Iron Man
suit.

823
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:11,760
All the free fall stuff was real
like that.

824
00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:14,320
Everybody getting dropped into
the water and stuff was all

825
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:17,640
practical, like on zip lines and
things getting slammed into the

826
00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:19,920
water.
So that, but that was a good one

827
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:23,000
where it was a healthy combo was
like, yeah, everything was

828
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:25,400
practical enough that everybody
knew it was shot for real.

829
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:28,960
The Foo Foo E FX stuff was
needed because it's a Marvel

830
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,400
movie, but it didn't.
There was no fakery and like the

831
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:34,560
jumping and stuff.
That was all real deal.

832
00:40:35,240 --> 00:40:37,000
Yeah, and.
Then like I said, the point

833
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,960
break movie was a little dis go.
Ahead, please, the Point Break

834
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:41,360
movie.
There's a little bit more.

835
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,680
Oh just the last example is like
the point Break movie is a funny

836
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:48,960
one to me because our sequence
is 100% was practical.

837
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,440
No CGI in it.
But because of a few lens

838
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:56,320
choices and editing styles like
they put shake in it.

839
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,360
They did like make the
background get blurry and things

840
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:02,320
but all the flying not one part
of it was faked or green

841
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:06,160
screened but nobody thought that
it was real all the way to the

842
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:09,560
point of like the Taurus stunt
awards where the stunt guys get

843
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:12,480
awards.
It's our one like award show of

844
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,840
the year.
The board that votes on

845
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,760
everything didn't want to
consider it as a stunt because

846
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:19,480
they didn't believe it was shot
for real.

847
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:22,400
I was going to ask how you even
know how there's too much.

848
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:24,280
Going in.
How do you tell?

849
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,520
How can you tell?
Can I tell if I'm watching a

850
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:28,000
movie?
Whether a movie, Whether stunts

851
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:32,920
are practical or not.
Sometimes, yeah, sometimes, no.

852
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,000
I mean, it's it really.
There's no direct answer to

853
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:37,600
that.
There's so much that goes into

854
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:38,520
it.
Yeah.

855
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,720
I mean, it could easily tell
when things are fake, that's for

856
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:42,800
sure.
Yeah, you could, you could.

857
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:45,960
The reason I asked about Iron
Man in particular because I have

858
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:47,920
a good friend of mine and we
were talking and we we've been

859
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:52,040
talking for years about how how
we feel, how it feels that that

860
00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:54,720
the CGI is being a little
overdone in in the big

861
00:41:54,720 --> 00:41:57,600
cinematic, you know, worlds,
whether it's Marvel, DC,

862
00:41:57,600 --> 00:42:00,000
whatever it was.
And we're and we're saying how

863
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:03,000
we missed the Iron Man days
where it feels just real enough

864
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,800
to like that.
It's like potentially could be

865
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,960
true, you know, like this big,
you know, bulky suit could exist

866
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,640
to like this stupid
nanotechnology where it just

867
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:15,080
like, you know, pops pops on his
head and you're like, OK, well,

868
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:17,440
I guess we're really checking
reality at the door over there.

869
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:19,720
So it's cool that you got to
that.

870
00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:23,680
You got to be part of that, that
that leg of of authenticity.

871
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:27,040
It's a lot of fun.
And what about I read about your

872
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:31,080
accident and your site 100 a
hundred mile an hour crash.

873
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:32,200
What?
What happened?

874
00:42:34,720 --> 00:42:37,280
Would you rather tax on it?
Oh yeah.

875
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:39,800
Oh no, I said which?
Which accent?

876
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:42,840
The one The most recent one like
on my Instagram.

877
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,960
I don't bad one.
No, no, I thought, I thought on

878
00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:49,840
your website, I was while I was
reading through about about, I

879
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:51,400
said that it was 100.
So.

880
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,000
Yeah, go ahead.
Yep, I know you're talking

881
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,440
about.
Yeah, so a long time ago that

882
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:01,240
was in, God, I'm going to guess
a little bit 2001, 2002,

883
00:43:01,240 --> 00:43:03,840
something like that.
One of my first ever stunt jobs

884
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:07,000
was for a Disney movie that
never even made it to to the

885
00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:08,760
screen.
So they cancelled the movie.

886
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:11,720
But but yeah, Long story short
on that, I was jumping out of a

887
00:43:11,720 --> 00:43:16,120
helicopter at like skydive
altitudes with skis on.

888
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,200
And the idea was to freefall
with skis, eventually pull a

889
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,240
parachute, land on the mountain,
ski away.

890
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,160
And we'd been doing it for a
couple weeks and it wasn't, I

891
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,360
mean, it was, it's challenging,
but it wasn't that.

892
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:27,880
It was like a one and done
thing.

893
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,360
It was pretty easy, but without
getting technical, I basically

894
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,400
when you pull your parachute,
you pull a little, what's a

895
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,080
little round pilot chute that
actually pulls your parachute

896
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,480
out.
So when I went to pull that, it

897
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:39,840
didn't do what it was supposed
to do.

898
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:43,000
So I was fiddling with it.
By the time I got it out, the

899
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,840
lines came out and wrapped
around my skis and boots and

900
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,320
bindings and everything and
basically a hog tied me up and I

901
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:53,080
took that into the ground from
6000 feet without a parachute

902
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:55,400
open.
A little bit of a parachute came

903
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:57,240
out.
So I had like trash above me,

904
00:43:57,240 --> 00:43:59,120
but there was no deployed
parachute.

905
00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:04,120
So I took that basically and
really close to free fall speeds

906
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:08,640
straight into the ground.
And strangely and, you know,

907
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:11,360
miraculously, I didn't break a
bone.

908
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:14,600
I didn't get hurt at all.
I was like, I was kind of like

909
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:17,880
laying there for a little bit
thinking I was dead, but I was

910
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:21,160
able to get up and walk away
from it, which was a miracle.

911
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,960
That sounds crazy.
What was go?

912
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:26,840
Do you remember?
You remember.

913
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:29,800
It is crazy.
That train of thought while that

914
00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:32,760
was happening, give me a train
of thought like, Oh no, Oh no,

915
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:34,560
Oh no.
And then like going black or you

916
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:36,320
remember, like what?
What was the What was the

917
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:40,600
thought process like?
No, I remember everything.

918
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:44,000
Most of my thought, I was pretty
newly married and most of my

919
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,920
thought process was being
worried about my wife and

920
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:50,440
largely about that.
And then it would flash to it

921
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:52,280
like, Oh my God, what are my
parents going to think?

922
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:55,160
And then worried about my wife.
And that was almost while I was

923
00:44:55,160 --> 00:44:58,160
dealing with the malfunction.
That's almost where my thought

924
00:44:58,160 --> 00:44:59,640
was.
The dealing with the malfunction

925
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:02,320
was pretty muscle memory, even
though it wasn't working because

926
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:05,680
I was all tied up.
Yeah.

927
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,840
And then and then the did you
black out the crash?

928
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:10,280
Do you?
You don't.

929
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,880
You don't remember it or.
No, no.

930
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:15,960
That's why I kind of feel like I
live in a parallel universe

931
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,120
right now, because it was all
black.

932
00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:22,280
I remember hitting and then
everything was black, but I had

933
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,760
the like the dialogue going on
in my mind.

934
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:27,200
So I was still talking to
myself.

935
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,280
And that's where I remember
having feelings, you know,

936
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:32,480
without getting deep into it, I
was having feelings of

937
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:35,160
excitement of going.
Like I remember thinking to

938
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:37,720
myself, oh, there is more,
something's coming because I

939
00:45:37,720 --> 00:45:40,680
know I'm dead, but I'm still
having a conversation with

940
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,360
myself.
And I remember getting excited

941
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:45,280
of like, OK, what's coming?
What's next?

942
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,760
What is it?
But then eventually the other

943
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,480
stunt guy about two minutes
later, because his parachute

944
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:52,400
actually worked.
So it took a while to get to me.

945
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:57,080
He landed next to me and the
sound of him landing I will open

946
00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:01,240
my eyes and then I realized I
was alive and I did the whole

947
00:46:01,240 --> 00:46:04,600
wiggle your toes your everything
and didn't feel any pain so I

948
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:07,760
set up and realized I was fine.
That's crazy.

949
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:11,000
That's a miracle.
That's like, I mean, that's

950
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:12,520
great percent.
It's so funny.

951
00:46:12,520 --> 00:46:18,760
I, you know, I mean, I don't, I
don't know, you know, what, what

952
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,040
your religious, you know, belief
is or not.

953
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:24,400
But you know, I feel like there
have been moments in my life

954
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:27,640
where God is just like yelled at
me or like I've just had like an

955
00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:31,360
experience that's just been like
God being like, yo, like snap

956
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:34,960
out of it for a minute, dude.
And like, whoa, like, yeah, I

957
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:37,280
need to snap out of that, you
know, And I even something

958
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:40,080
stupid, like there's one time I
was pushing myself way too much.

959
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:44,200
I was biting off more than I
could handle, I think, in my

960
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:47,280
life and responsibilities, and I
was driving from one place to

961
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:48,920
the next.
And I'm doing a podcast and I

962
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,480
have three in one day and I have
my sales job and I'm going to

963
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:55,480
teach and I miss I'm running
late for class and and and I'm

964
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:59,280
pulling out of a parking lot
while like doing all this and a

965
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:06,760
car and while I'm pulling out a
car pulls out two and like, you

966
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:08,680
know, nips my car.
I guess give me a little Fender

967
00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:10,320
Bender.
Wasn't there, wasn't bad damage,

968
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:14,760
wasn't, you know, a big deal,
but like it just like hold me

969
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:16,760
out of it for a second, you
know, we like you just feel

970
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:19,200
like, you know, there's like a
mask over your head and like you

971
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:22,920
can't breathe and then you just
like pull it off and whoa, like

972
00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:25,560
I got to balance, you know, I
got to figure something out.

973
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,000
I feel like, you know, I've had,
I've had.

974
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,200
Moments now back to reality.
Yeah.

975
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:31,480
And we're God.
And I think that is God being.

976
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,440
And I don't know what God is or
who or what or anything like

977
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,120
that, you know, but I think
there's something that I don't

978
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:39,920
know what it is, but but
whatever it is, it's spoken to

979
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:45,320
me, you.
Know I feel like yeah, I agree,

980
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,040
man, there's there's higher
power for sure.

981
00:47:47,720 --> 00:47:51,280
Yeah.
And the human meteor flight, the

982
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:55,520
thing where I don't know if I
understood that properly was

983
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,760
that that people thought that
people were seeing people do

984
00:47:57,760 --> 00:48:00,960
stunts and thought they were
Uaps or thought they were UFOs

985
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:02,160
or anything like that.
Yeah.

986
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:05,280
Is that what it was?
Yeah, it's kind of.

987
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:08,280
It's funny, every time we do a
night jump, we have pyrotechnics

988
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:11,240
on our feet, OK.
And because the way we're, we're

989
00:48:11,240 --> 00:48:14,280
so high up and because the way
we fly, it's kind of

990
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:16,920
unexplainable.
No aircraft would be maneuvering

991
00:48:16,920 --> 00:48:20,240
like we are.
So anybody that is hoping for

992
00:48:20,240 --> 00:48:24,760
UFO type sightings, the second
they see that it almost every

993
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:28,760
town we ever do it in, there's
the news gets called, the 911

994
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:31,480
gets called, people are like
there's no way.

995
00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:33,800
There's no airplane, there's no
helicopter, there's nothing that

996
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,120
could maneuver like that.
You know that.

997
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:38,480
Does that make you more
skeptical about the whole UIP

998
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:41,640
thing?
No being in the background like

999
00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:43,000
that.
Oh yeah, for sure.

1000
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:46,000
But I also, I'm not too
skeptical because I, I don't

1001
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:48,760
know if they've come to our
planet, but I'm a firm believer

1002
00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:50,240
there has to be other life out
there.

1003
00:48:50,240 --> 00:48:53,560
We we can't be alone in this.
Yeah, I believe that too.

1004
00:48:54,160 --> 00:48:56,800
I believe that too.
I think that I think there's two

1005
00:48:56,840 --> 00:48:59,240
true statements happening
concurrently.

1006
00:48:59,240 --> 00:49:02,640
There's other life and then
there's what we're perceiving is

1007
00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,320
happening, which could be a dude
like you, you know, taking off

1008
00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:08,800
from Florida to the middle of
the night, you know, and, and me

1009
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:11,520
not knowing what the heck that
is in the sky, you know, And I

1010
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:13,720
think they're both truths.
What's, what do you like?

1011
00:49:13,720 --> 00:49:15,520
Do you like day jumping or night
jumping more?

1012
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:22,960
I mean, in general, day jumping
just because it's safer, you

1013
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:27,440
know, I guess it's more than
norm, but night jumps are super

1014
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:29,000
special.
Depends on what you're doing.

1015
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,520
You know, Most of the time a
night jump for me in my world is

1016
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:35,960
I'm doing shows.
So it's more about just like the

1017
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:38,080
performance of what we're doing.
Yeah.

1018
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:40,960
You know, it's a rare day that I
go out to a drop zone and just

1019
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,640
do a night jump for fun.
What's the show like?

1020
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:45,960
What's the show?
What's the what's the show like?

1021
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:51,640
They're all they're all a little
bit different.

1022
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:53,600
It depends on what what we're
doing it for.

1023
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:58,000
OK, Like if you go to my
Instagram handle, the last one

1024
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,840
of the last ones I posted is we
jumped into Sun and Fun, a huge

1025
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,080
air show in Florida, in
Lakeland, FL.

1026
00:50:04,720 --> 00:50:08,040
And we did a show where we have
an airplane that dives at a

1027
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:12,200
pretty steep angle and it was
shooting fireworks out the side

1028
00:50:12,200 --> 00:50:14,440
of it.
And we're flying wingsuits with

1029
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:18,600
the pyro on us chasing and
slaloming through the fireworks.

1030
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:21,200
So the crowd is seeing all this
from the ground.

1031
00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:23,680
So.
Cool that that kind of stuff.

1032
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:26,640
Wearing glow suits.
Yeah, yeah.

1033
00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:29,040
What's the coordinating stuff?
That's all fun show stuff.

1034
00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:31,200
What's it like to coordinate
that?

1035
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:36,200
It's step by step.
I, yeah, it, I mean, air shows

1036
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:38,400
are a little different animal,
but in general, like our, our

1037
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:40,960
demo team, I'll, I'll coordinate
all the FAA stuff.

1038
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,320
So for me it's just plug and
play.

1039
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:46,480
It's just collecting the proper
information, filling out forms,

1040
00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:50,520
sending it in, getting it
approved in time, that kind of

1041
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:54,320
stuff and then putting together
the right team to go to it, you

1042
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:57,960
know, so there's a whole stair
step process of coordinating it

1043
00:50:57,960 --> 00:50:59,840
to happen.
But by now it's I've been doing

1044
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:02,280
it so long it's.
I imagine it's a pretty small

1045
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:04,960
world, right?
It's a pretty small, you know,

1046
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:08,520
aerial sport world as far as
knowing one another and getting

1047
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:13,160
a team together and whatever.
Yeah, for sure.

1048
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:16,280
I mean, for all the shows I do
demo wise, it's all the Red Bull

1049
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:18,560
Air Force team.
So I I've assembled over the

1050
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:21,880
years that we're a nine man
skydiving team.

1051
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:23,800
So that's what I use for all the
shows.

1052
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:26,680
But but, yeah, the sport's small
enough that whether it's the

1053
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:29,360
stunt world that I need to
branch out for my Red Bull team

1054
00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:32,440
or we're doing a demo that's
bigger than what we already have

1055
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:35,360
as a team, it's a small little
pool of people.

1056
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:37,080
Off Like off phone call.
Yeah.

1057
00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:38,160
And.
Can you tell me about your

1058
00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:39,560
career with Red Bull a little
bit?

1059
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,160
How'd that get started?
Or what do you what do you do

1060
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:42,640
with?
Them.

1061
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:48,480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So it's, it's been a really

1062
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:52,120
long, amazing, fun ride.
So I was lucky enough through

1063
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:56,400
two of my teammates and friends
at the time, Charles Bryan and

1064
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:58,840
Mike Vale.
So Red Bull moved to America

1065
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:04,760
roughly in 9697 and they went to
the Vale, Aspany, World of

1066
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:09,240
Skiing and Lake Tahoe as kind of
their test markets to see if

1067
00:52:09,240 --> 00:52:11,320
their product would even work in
America.

1068
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:15,760
And they started sponsoring a
few athletes and luckily Rebel

1069
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:20,000
gives you wings or we might not
have a sponsor, but so they

1070
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:23,680
picked up some skiers and a
couple skydivers and BASE

1071
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,520
jumpers.
And then luckily at the time I

1072
00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:29,960
was still super young, but I was
already like world champion

1073
00:52:29,960 --> 00:52:34,320
skydive guy with a big name.
And so right place, right time

1074
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:38,120
at the right people.
And I officially signed on with

1075
00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:42,160
Red Bull in 99 as a contracted
hat wearing athlete.

1076
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:46,120
There you go.
And so in the first few years,

1077
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,160
you know, the team was kind of a
mix of some skydivers, BASE

1078
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:53,880
jumpers, paragliders.
It was loosely run by everybody

1079
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:55,960
in the beginning.
But then one of the paragliders,

1080
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:59,160
Oathar, kind of took the reins
to be like, hey, let's get more

1081
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:02,120
organization behind the team
instead of just being

1082
00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:03,760
individuals on their own
mission.

1083
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:07,760
And that lasted a few years.
And then he stepped down from

1084
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:10,760
that role, and I quickly stepped
up into it because I was already

1085
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:15,160
helping him coordinate stuff.
So when he stepped down, I fully

1086
00:53:15,160 --> 00:53:18,440
took over managing and team
captaining the Red Bull Air

1087
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:21,000
Force.
And one by one I was able to

1088
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:24,400
bring on kind of my really good
friends or slash teammates that

1089
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:27,800
I'd met in skydiving.
As the brand grew, they wanted

1090
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,120
the team to grow.
So I was able to kind of grow

1091
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:32,040
the team into more than just a
few people.

1092
00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:34,520
Sure.
And now we're one of the most

1093
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:36,560
heavily used marketing tools for
Red Bull.

1094
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:40,440
So whether it's jumping into an
F1 race or a weird party or

1095
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:44,320
everything in the middle, you
know, we do 50 plus shows a year

1096
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:46,800
all around the world as just
demos.

1097
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:50,680
And then Red Bull also supports,
you know, athletes in a really

1098
00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:54,040
unique way where they want
athletes to pitch dream projects

1099
00:53:54,040 --> 00:53:57,120
and missions.
And a lot of them are no's or we

1100
00:53:57,120 --> 00:53:59,000
don't have time for that or the
bandwidth for it.

1101
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:02,640
But every now and then one's a
yes and you get to go fulfill an

1102
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:05,080
athlete dream and go, go do a
project.

1103
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:11,320
So it's been since 99 till now,
you know, 2025, six years of of

1104
00:54:11,320 --> 00:54:15,800
living dreams.
Are there So what are some type

1105
00:54:15,800 --> 00:54:19,000
of typically, and I'm not going
to ask your personal, but like

1106
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:22,640
typically speaking in a contract
when they sign on an athlete,

1107
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:26,200
they want minimum amount of
events or displays or

1108
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:30,520
performances a year or is how
what how does that work for from

1109
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:31,800
them?
What do they want from you?

1110
00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:36,440
Yeah, there's not a generic,
there's not a generic template.

1111
00:54:36,440 --> 00:54:38,920
I can't really speak on how they
deal with snowboarders,

1112
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:40,640
skateboarders, all the other
sports.

1113
00:54:40,640 --> 00:54:42,840
They sure they're in every sport
on the planet, you know.

1114
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:45,240
Mm hmm.
And so I really don't know how

1115
00:54:45,240 --> 00:54:47,680
those athlete contracts work,
right?

1116
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:50,480
But in general, you know, they,
you know, we're a little bit

1117
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:52,320
different cause a lot of
athletes are just sponsored to

1118
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:53,960
go do what they do as an
athlete.

1119
00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:55,720
Yeah.
But we're a heavily used

1120
00:54:55,720 --> 00:54:58,160
marketing team as well with all
the shows we do.

1121
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:01,840
So we're a little bit different
where, yes, we have a certain

1122
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:04,880
like athlete contract that, you
know, they subsidized

1123
00:55:04,880 --> 00:55:08,840
financially us to some level.
But then we also, you know, go

1124
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:12,400
and do jobs and go do shows and
things of that nature.

1125
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:16,040
So it's it's.
It's not a direct answer to just

1126
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:17,200
there's.
No, I got.

1127
00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:18,480
I got to do it.
Yeah.

1128
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:23,760
I was, I was curious about about
because I, I didn't, yeah.

1129
00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:27,800
My association I feel with Red
Bull is soccer.

1130
00:55:27,800 --> 00:55:30,760
And then the other sports that
you were describing like skiing

1131
00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:33,040
and and and aerial sports and
stuff like that.

1132
00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:37,680
What who are some who are some
of your role models in the

1133
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:42,360
either film world or sports
world that that kind of, you

1134
00:55:42,360 --> 00:55:44,840
know, either motivate you or
inspire you?

1135
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:51,640
That's a good question.
I mean, are we?

1136
00:55:51,640 --> 00:55:57,120
Sad or an obvious?
Answer is, I don't really, yeah.

1137
00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:01,640
I mean, in the in the stunt
world, I have a few second unit

1138
00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:04,800
directors that I super look up
to that after working with them,

1139
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:08,720
I really realized that they both
came from the stunt world.

1140
00:56:08,720 --> 00:56:11,280
They were just traditional
ground and pound stuntmen,

1141
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:15,040
worked their way up to being
coordinators, turned into really

1142
00:56:15,040 --> 00:56:18,440
successful second unit directors
and now we're going into

1143
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:20,800
directing.
You know, I've watched their

1144
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:23,600
career progressed so amazingly.
You know, it's like Wade

1145
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:25,680
Eastwood and Jeff Haberstadter
too.

1146
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,560
They really stand out.
You know, they're really big

1147
00:56:29,560 --> 00:56:32,920
famous second unit directors
these days, but they also just

1148
00:56:32,920 --> 00:56:36,200
started like any traditional
stunt guy that had a vision

1149
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:40,560
beyond just doing stunts.
So to kind of watch their stair

1150
00:56:40,560 --> 00:56:44,400
step is really impressive.
And then in the world of like

1151
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:47,200
sports directly, it's really, I
don't have direct names, but

1152
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:50,760
just anybody that's not afraid,
you know, like whether it's in

1153
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:54,040
the surf world, you know, I've
watched, you know, Kai Lenny go

1154
00:56:54,040 --> 00:56:57,960
from being a too young to even
be sponsored young serf kid up

1155
00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:00,640
to who he is today.
And just always being innovative

1156
00:57:00,640 --> 00:57:04,800
and not being stuck in a rut and
doing things different in his

1157
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:09,200
own way is really impressive to,
you know, in the skydive world,

1158
00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:12,160
you know, where it's like, you
know, people that have just

1159
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:16,880
learned how to, to chase their
dreams and not just get

1160
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:19,480
pigeonholed into one corner.
So I don't really have a name.

1161
00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:21,680
It's just sure, sure, a long
list of people.

1162
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:23,720
I should probably put you on
hold for two seconds because my

1163
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:25,800
computer's about to die.
I need to have my.

1164
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:29,040
Plug or I'm going to die on you,
OK?

1165
00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:36,560
We're back.
Sorry about that.

1166
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:39,600
Do you?
Are you?

1167
00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:43,000
Are you Oh, that's what one of
the one of the few things, the

1168
00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:44,440
last couple of things I want to
talk about.

1169
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:49,840
First of all, green screens does
that.

1170
00:57:49,840 --> 00:57:53,880
Do you hate them?
No, I mean, they serve a great

1171
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,200
purpose.
So I don't think there's

1172
00:57:56,200 --> 00:57:59,320
anything negative about them.
I think, you know, there's,

1173
00:57:59,320 --> 00:58:02,680
there's some things that it's,
it takes away from the being the

1174
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:05,800
practical stunt performance, but
there's some things that's very

1175
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:08,360
much needed.
So I don't have any hate for

1176
00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:11,000
them by any means.
Usually when I get hired, you

1177
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:13,880
know, because I'm a specialty
stunt guy, so I'm not just the

1178
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,600
traditional stuntman.
So it's usually they're hiring

1179
00:58:17,600 --> 00:58:19,680
me because they want to go do it
for real.

1180
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:21,400
They're not trying to fake it.
Yeah.

1181
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:23,560
So I don't have a even a ton of
experience.

1182
00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:24,800
I mean, I've been around it a
lot, but.

1183
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:27,520
I was going to ask whether they
ever asked you to do that.

1184
00:58:27,520 --> 00:58:29,280
I feel like it could be kind of
a waste of your skills.

1185
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:31,080
But I feel like, you know, I
mean, I must have built some

1186
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:34,840
really cool chamber, you know,
indoor skydiving place that, you

1187
00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:39,200
know, they could, I guess, kind
of use a lot of CGI for.

1188
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:42,520
But I can't imagine they bring
you in to have you sit in front

1189
00:58:42,520 --> 00:58:45,240
of a green screen, right?
Yeah, I mean, one of the the

1190
00:58:45,240 --> 00:58:50,400
coolest ones, that was the very
first Iron Man, when Iron Man

1191
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:53,280
was learning to fly his suit in
his garage and he thrashed all

1192
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:54,760
his cars.
Yeah, sure.

1193
00:58:55,760 --> 00:58:58,720
And when he first flew and he
flew by the Ferris wheel and the

1194
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:00,440
kids were licking the ice cream.
Yeah, sure.

1195
00:59:00,800 --> 00:59:05,120
So I, I met with Jon Favreau in
the wind tunnel and we green

1196
00:59:05,120 --> 00:59:09,680
screened the all the glass of
the tunnel and we, without

1197
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:13,240
getting into how we did it, but
we flew around in the tunnel for

1198
00:59:13,240 --> 00:59:16,440
him to record everything.
And then they took that and

1199
00:59:16,440 --> 00:59:19,320
placed it on the Iron Man
character.

1200
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:23,480
So things like my feet were tied
to the tunnel wall and I'm in a

1201
00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:27,120
flying tracking position and he
would be in my ear and he'd be

1202
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:30,040
like, OK, now look left.
What you're looking at is

1203
00:59:30,040 --> 00:59:32,200
children licking an ice cream.
And I had no idea what he's

1204
00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:34,200
talking about.
Then when the movie came out,

1205
00:59:34,200 --> 00:59:35,800
I'm like, oh shit, that's
exactly this.

1206
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:37,800
Wow.
So cool more.

1207
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:43,160
Than like I put a a small like
or a big long board skateboard

1208
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:47,040
on my feet in the tunnel because
to lift in the air you need to

1209
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:49,520
grab air.
So but he's like Iron Man's

1210
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:51,240
hands are down and he's
shooting.

1211
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:53,320
So how can we do that but then
lift?

1212
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:57,760
So what we decided was I'd put a
board on my feet and we'd slowly

1213
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:01,360
turn up the wind and eventually
the wind strong enough that the

1214
01:00:01,360 --> 01:00:04,560
board would just lift me so I
could keep my hands down.

1215
01:00:04,960 --> 01:00:07,240
So little things like that.
So sometimes green screen's

1216
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:11,240
super cool, but.
And it's probably crazy watching

1217
01:00:11,240 --> 01:00:13,600
that, watching that process back
and it'd be like, oh, now I get

1218
01:00:13,600 --> 01:00:15,600
it.
Yeah, the the coolest thing on

1219
01:00:15,600 --> 01:00:19,440
that job, just to wrap that
story up is I was like, hey, I'm

1220
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:21,760
going to play around in here.
So for like 2 minutes in the one

1221
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:23,960
tunnel, I'm just doing a
freestyle routine, flying

1222
01:00:23,960 --> 01:00:25,640
around, layout, spinning,
whatever.

1223
01:00:26,080 --> 01:00:30,000
And then I come out of that and
the CGI guy instantly goes, come

1224
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:31,480
here.
And he put me in his computer

1225
01:00:32,040 --> 01:00:35,200
and what should have just been a
video of me flying in the

1226
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,640
tunnel, he laid over the Iron
Man suit.

1227
01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:42,360
And so I saw then it looked like
Iron Man.

1228
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:45,680
But everybody that skydives to
my level has a certain style.

1229
01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:48,200
You could be like, oh, that's so
and so because look how his legs

1230
01:00:48,200 --> 01:00:51,200
are or whatever.
So I'm seeing what's obviously

1231
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:53,680
me doing like helicopters and
flips.

1232
01:00:54,080 --> 01:00:56,920
But it looked like Iron Man.
So to me I was like, Oh my God,

1233
01:00:56,920 --> 01:00:58,600
please send me that.
And he couldn't but.

1234
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:02,840
Wow, he couldn't send it to you?
No, it's totally fine.

1235
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:04,640
Do you think?
Do you think what you do is the

1236
01:01:04,640 --> 01:01:08,160
coolest thing in the world?
I think sometimes yes, sometimes

1237
01:01:08,160 --> 01:01:10,800
no, but.
Yeah, I hear.

1238
01:01:11,080 --> 01:01:14,760
I'm I and the one of the last
things I wanted to talk to you a

1239
01:01:14,760 --> 01:01:18,120
little bit about is actually
circling back to the beginning

1240
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:21,400
in terms of family and you know
where you're living in

1241
01:01:21,400 --> 01:01:23,200
California is, you know,
Southern California.

1242
01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:29,360
First of all, do you have plans
to leave Southern California?

1243
01:01:30,320 --> 01:01:31,560
You or do you have?
Ambitions.

1244
01:01:32,200 --> 01:01:36,760
Are you asking me or my wife?
I'm, I guess, I guess your wife

1245
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:39,720
probably matters more in the in
the decision, but I'll ask you

1246
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:43,520
because I'm talking to you.
Well, I'll just be honest with

1247
01:01:43,520 --> 01:01:45,720
that answer.
This is a place I never wanted

1248
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:48,600
to live.
It's not who I am mentally, you

1249
01:01:48,600 --> 01:01:51,080
know, all that stuff.
But the opportunities it

1250
01:01:51,240 --> 01:01:53,720
provided me, I wouldn't be where
I was at without living here.

1251
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:55,760
So I'm I'm not upset with the
thing.

1252
01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:58,920
But yeah, I've always had a goal
of eventually, once the kids

1253
01:01:58,920 --> 01:02:02,960
grow up and move out, I think
the real honest answer is we're

1254
01:02:02,960 --> 01:02:05,600
going to hope my two daughters
live in the same place and we

1255
01:02:05,600 --> 01:02:07,920
move to wherever they live
because we want to have that

1256
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:13,000
family life.
But my desire is to move back to

1257
01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:15,600
the mountain type world and be
in that environment.

1258
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:19,560
So yeah, I don't want to be here
forever, but it's served a great

1259
01:02:19,560 --> 01:02:21,320
purpose.
I could imagine, yeah.

1260
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,000
That's how I was going to.
Yeah, because I was talking to

1261
01:02:23,120 --> 01:02:25,480
the the previous gentleman that
I was talking to.

1262
01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:29,600
He he he was in Chicago and he's
like, you know, for a couple

1263
01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:32,280
years I had to live in LA.
He goes into a certain point.

1264
01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:34,760
Once I kind of got my name into
the rotation, I wonder who I

1265
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:35,640
was.
I had a little bit more

1266
01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:38,440
flexibility to kind of move
around and, you know, and get

1267
01:02:38,440 --> 01:02:40,120
out of that, get out of that
scene a little bit.

1268
01:02:41,200 --> 01:02:43,880
Yeah.
But it's really.

1269
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:45,240
Yeah.
And I was actually, I was going

1270
01:02:45,240 --> 01:02:49,080
to ask about that.
Like, I mean, I, I know

1271
01:02:49,080 --> 01:02:51,920
practical, I know that it's
practical for work, but if don't

1272
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:55,760
you feel like you have a, you
know, a reputation, a name, you

1273
01:02:55,760 --> 01:02:57,920
know, you've been doing this for
long enough that you could

1274
01:02:57,920 --> 01:02:59,440
hypothetically live somewhere
and travel more?

1275
01:02:59,440 --> 01:03:00,480
Or is it the travel that's
going?

1276
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:04,920
To be, Oh no, I could be gone
years ago, but when I'm raising

1277
01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:07,000
kids here, so I don't want to
pull them out of school.

1278
01:03:07,280 --> 01:03:11,720
And my wife's attorney with a
big job and she has her own

1279
01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:13,800
career going.
On another another do her thing.

1280
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:16,720
Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.
Cool, cool, cool, cool.

1281
01:03:16,960 --> 01:03:20,280
Well, that's awesome.
I John, I really appreciate the

1282
01:03:20,280 --> 01:03:22,280
time, man.
Thank you so much for taking the

1283
01:03:22,280 --> 01:03:24,200
time to talk to me today.
This is such a pleasure.

1284
01:03:24,800 --> 01:03:27,160
It's so cool to hear about this
little world in the background.

1285
01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:30,120
And I'm going to text you and I
watch that movie, The

1286
01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:33,280
Unwritables because nice.
I'm really, I'm really excited

1287
01:03:33,280 --> 01:03:35,280
about that.
But this is this is so cool.

1288
01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:37,440
And I really appreciate your
time and I love what you've been

1289
01:03:37,440 --> 01:03:39,160
working on.
I love what your career has

1290
01:03:39,160 --> 01:03:41,240
become.
And how long does a stunt career

1291
01:03:41,240 --> 01:03:45,560
last usually?
I would say right about in my

1292
01:03:45,560 --> 01:03:49,720
age is where most either
stuntmen are slowing down a lot

1293
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:52,640
or trying to transition into
coordinating and not taking the

1294
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:55,000
hits.
Yeah, you know, but it's a

1295
01:03:55,000 --> 01:03:58,200
young, a real ground and pound
stuntman career is a young man's

1296
01:03:58,200 --> 01:04:00,240
game.
You get beat up, whether it's

1297
01:04:00,240 --> 01:04:03,720
just taking falls or hits or
fight scenes, whatever.

1298
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:07,960
Yeah, you know, so somewhere in
the the young 40s you'd you'd

1299
01:04:07,960 --> 01:04:12,160
hear most stuntmen trying to
figure out either up leveling

1300
01:04:12,160 --> 01:04:15,440
the job title or moving on.
And you think you'd like to stay

1301
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:18,440
in the If you had to choose
between the sports world and the

1302
01:04:18,440 --> 01:04:20,560
coordinating or the
entertainment world, which which

1303
01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:25,000
which do you enjoy more?
That's a tricky one.

1304
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:28,760
I would be.
Directing movies tomorrow or you

1305
01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:32,400
could be, you know, do you know
a big part of the sports

1306
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:35,360
coordinating you know and you
know for the for the whole sport

1307
01:04:35,360 --> 01:04:37,680
and being an ambassador for it
is one.

1308
01:04:37,760 --> 01:04:40,520
Yeah, probably the answer to
that is if I had to pick one.

1309
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:42,440
Yeah.
As long as I could still skydive

1310
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:47,520
for fun, I think I would have a
dream of being like second unit

1311
01:04:47,520 --> 01:04:52,160
directing, you know, some dream
movies that I've I have in my

1312
01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:55,840
mind that would be a an amazing
end of the career.

1313
01:04:56,680 --> 01:04:58,960
You know, kind of put out some
movies that I've always wanted

1314
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:00,760
to try to pitch to the right
people.

1315
01:05:01,000 --> 01:05:02,920
Yeah, well, if you ever do, let
me know.

1316
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:04,560
I'd love to.
I'd love to watch them.

1317
01:05:04,560 --> 01:05:06,080
I'd love to see when the film
comes out of them.

1318
01:05:06,360 --> 01:05:07,560
John, thanks so much for the
time, man.

1319
01:05:07,560 --> 01:05:09,240
I really appreciate it.
Best of luck with everything,

1320
01:05:09,240 --> 01:05:10,360
man.
Take care.

1321
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:11,440
Have a good one.
Bye.