Science Series 1: Dr Kevin Hickerman /Nuclear Physics / StandUp Comedy / Scientific Advising on Thor

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Welcome to another episode of
Come Together.

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Cool.
We're live Doctor, Doctor Kevin

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Peter Hickerson.
Welcome.

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I'm so excited to be talking to
you today.

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How are you?
I'm.

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Great.
Thanks for having me.

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Yeah.
I, I was thinking since, since

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our conversation of different
ways to kind of tackle our

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conversation because I kind of
want it to be as fun and

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entertaining as possible, but I
also want to get kind of behind

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the mind of the guy that is a
stand up comedian and a nuclear

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physicist.
And do you look at them?

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Do you look at those two parts
of yourself like they're

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conflicting or they're just like
different parts of yourself that

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you feel like you have to
exercise and, you know,

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creatively express?
For me internally, it's not a

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conflict for me personally, but
professionally, they're kind of

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a conflict on both sides.
Nuclear physics isn't inherently

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funny, but then the other is,
you know, in my professional

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research and my colleagues and
now starting a company,

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sometimes I think people are
worried that, you know, oh,

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you're not serious.
I mean, I've literally been at

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conferences where people said,
Oh, are you leaving Hollywood or

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something?
Like it was a binary choice or

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something.
And I'm like, well, no, I still

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live here and I still do comedy.
And they're like, oh, I thought

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you left physics to do it.
And, and because from their

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point of view, that's that's
what it's like.

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It's like they're like, oh, you
left physics to you gave up on

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physics to do to go tell Dick
jokes or.

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Something.
And it's.

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It's not really and, but, but
there's, there's some other

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conflicts too, just having to do
with time.

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So I got to the point in doing
stand up where to really go any

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further, I would have had to go
on tour regularly.

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That would have interfered with
being a physicist.

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And I did have to kind of make a
choice there.

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And I decided I'm, I'm a better
nuclear physicist than I am a

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comedian.
I, I think I'm a pretty good

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comedian, but you know, there's
a lot of people who are a lot, a

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lot of my friends are better at
it than me, that's for sure.

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But, but, but more importantly,
it's just like both take a lot

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of time and I think what I have
to offer the world is far more

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important in the nuclear physics
side.

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So it's, it's, it's a little bit
like growing up, you know, I

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guess I was like, OK, as much
fun as it because it's stand up

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comedy is really fun.
It's not just fun being on

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stage, but the, the love and,
and outpouring of, of, you know,

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fans telling you they, they love
your comedy is a really big ego

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boost.
It is really nice and you know,

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when I get off stage talking
about a new research for putting

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limits on, you know, neutron
oscillations or something, I, I,

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you know, people might, you
know, the, the, the best side of

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respect is like, that was a good
talk.

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This is like that could mean the
world in nuclear physics, but it

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doesn't quite feel the same, you
know?

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What's the tell me, can you tell
me about the how'd you get

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started with the stand up and
what was the what's the process

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for writing jokes?
And I know that, you know, a lot

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of different comics will go
between writing out like every

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beat and like everything is
exact.

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And then a lot of comics will
have general gist to points that

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they want to get to and like,
you know, bits and then they

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kind of twinkle with it on, you
know, while they're performing.

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I'm just.
Wondering the answer first that

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how did I get started or how do
I write jokes.

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Those are very different
questions.

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How did you get started?
And then you could tell you how

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you wrote.
Jokes would be great.

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So.
I've always been interested in

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entertainment.
In fact, I really wanted to be

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an actor.
And again, I didn't I wanted to

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be a physicist, but I also
wanted to be an actor as a kid.

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And I, I joined a local stage
group when I was a kid and I

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really liked singing and being
on stage and, you know, so that

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was really fun.
But I, I didn't have the

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Hollywood connection that a lot
of like nepo kids have where,

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you know, they're booked in ads
and stuff like that early.

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My, my parents just didn't know
how to do that and didn't have a

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way to do that.
So I was being interested in

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Hollywood.
And I used to make movies when I

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was a kid with my sister, my
friends and, you know, for, for

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fun.
And that was really fun, but I

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didn't really think about being
a comedian specifically,

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although I think I was a pretty
funny guy as a kid.

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I mean, I made people laugh and
stuff like that.

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But the part that I didn't start
doing stand up, I didn't really

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occur to me to try and do stand
up until this one day.

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I was going to a show, Dean Cook
was headlining.

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It was at the Improv and as a
prank before the show, because

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we were sitting in the front, I
got up on stage and my my wife

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at the time, she took a photo of
it and I posted social media

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saying I just opened for Dane
Cook and that it was a joke.

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It was totally a joke.
And you know, oh, I'm so excited

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opening for Dane.
By the way, when you start off

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comedy, you don't get to yeah,
find out about that.

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Doesn't that never happens ever,
ever, ever, ever, ever.

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But anyway, it was still a funny
joke.

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But the part of it was it was
hilarious because all these

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people like, Oh my God, Kevin, I
didn't know you didn't stand up.

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That's so awesome.
I want to see your show.

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There's just like tons of people
were so excited about it.

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And I was like, oh, crap,
actually open for Dane Cook.

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Oh, man, this is embarrassing.
So then I said, OK, fine, I'm

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going to try comedy.
And about five years later, I

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opened for Dane Cook.
Wow, really?

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Yeah, five years though you just
do it on your.

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Course try.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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certainly OK.
It's the.

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Path that all comedians have to
go through.

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You have to start with open
mics, then you can do these,

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these book shows usually like
there's a type of show called

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bringer shows, which are really
painful.

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Bring your shows is where you
have to do all the promoting.

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The show is famous and stuff.
And then and then I started to

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get from there.
I got book shows and then, you

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know, I started being able to
perform at real clubs like

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improv and the Comedy Store.
And I eventually got onto, you

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know, I got a Booker who put me
on shows with like, really great

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comedians.
To be.

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The, you know, the first or
second act in these shows with

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like, like heavy hitters.
That's amazing.

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Nikki Glazier, Joe Rogan, Dean
Cook, Anthony Jeselnik, all

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kinds of great comedians
regularly.

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Like, you know, every couple of
weeks I'd get to do a show in

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the main room of the Comedy
Store and do smaller shows off

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to the side, so.
I want to add 22 follow-ups on

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that real quick.
Number one was how long did

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those five years feel and what'd
you do to slog through?

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Because I know that long.
No, it was, you know, because.

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It's really fun and it's a lot
of it's a lot of practice

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because that's one of the
reasons why no matter how you

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know, as much as people want to
say that like that person is

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just naturally funny, like
talent, natural talent matters,

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I guess, a little bit.
But a lot of what the public

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doesn't know is that there is a
lot of work to refining jokes,

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which brings me to your second
question.

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How do I write jokes?
Yeah, I generally, like most

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comedians, usually have a thing
called set list, which is just a

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piece of paper that has a very
short reference to the joke.

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And it has less to do with like,
like one thing you don't do when

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you do comedy obviously, is you
don't sit there going.

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So a man walked into a bar and
said, what's the deal with

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airline food?
Like that's the you don't.

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You're not saying they're
reading that.

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So instead, there's like a
little line on there, you know,

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like that.
And a set list is usually just a

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reminder.
And the reason is because one of

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the things that can happen if
you especially if you're

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starting new material, you might
forget what joke you wrote.

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You know, even if you, you said
it before, you did it already

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maybe two or three times.
So, so it's to jog your memory

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more than anything.
So a set list is more like that.

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So if you've ever seen, I'm sure
you've seen video of sometimes a

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comic like goes over to the,
the, the stool next to them,

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like looks down and goes, oh,
yeah, I was, oh, my God, I was

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in Portland the other day.
You know that that's what

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they're doing.
Probably what probably all the

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thing that was written on the
piece of paper was Portland.

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Sure.
It's just a reminder.

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And it's it's also the order
that they're supposed to go in

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because also a thing that
generally the audience doesn't

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know, but comedians know is like
they're a set has to have a flow

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to it because there's jokes
usually reference each other or

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they're building off of some
meta story or something like

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that.
So, so the order matters to kind

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of, you know, sometimes And so
especially if you do a call back

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to a previous thing, you have to
make sure that you you said the

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thing that you call back.
To yeah, yeah, sure, sure.

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Because that could be that won't
land if you if you tell a call

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back and everyone's like, why is
he talking about Portland?

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What the hell?
Who do you think are some of the

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sharpest comedians today?
That you that you enjoy?

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That you enjoy their content
sharpest.

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That's a tough one.
Yeah, I, I get asked this a lot,

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but I, I don't like answering
it.

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And part of the reason is
because like like.

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I gotcha.
Your friends for being a

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comedian is not necessarily like
who is the funniest or who the

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public thinks is the funniest
because there's a lot of great

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comedians on stage who are
assholes and they're the other

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way around.
So, and then some people are

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just the same, you know, like,
like one of the, one of the

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things I like pointing out is
like Theo Von is a great

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example.
He has a personality that you

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see on it.
And you might be tempted to

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think like, oh, he's probably
not like that in real life or

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something, but he, he totally
is.

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He's like really legit dude.
He's really nice in person and

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everything.
And and then some people are,

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you know, they, they're kind of
an asshole on stage.

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Like Ryan Chang is the example.
Ryan Chang, he's he's an

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example.
He's on The Daily Show.

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He's super nice.
It he's like the nicest person

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and despite the fact that he's
he's on TV and pretty well

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known, but he always plays like
an, you know, he's.

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Always.
Yeah.

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It's like Bob Saget or something
like that.

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What?
What?

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What's?
I don't even know.

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That's too.
Sharpest That's a hard one to

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answer because there's also a
lot of comedians I find really

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funny.
But they're they're funny in a

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way that is very controversial.
And so I got to be careful,

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buddy.
Correct.

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Well, you know, if you careful
with it, too careful, at least

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with me.
But I, I look what I love.

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I mean, my particular style that
relates that, that speaks to me

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most is I love to be taken on a
ride and then not know and like

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have that roller coaster twist
at the end and like be thrown

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out of left field.
So I don't laugh at vulgar for

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the sake of vulgarity.
I don't laugh at like, you know,

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sex jokes for the sake of it.
Like I, it's cute like haha.

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But like, I laugh a lot when
like, you take me along a bunch

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of steps and I'm expecting you
to go one way and then you just

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veer.
Advantage I had as being a

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nuclear physicist.
Like I don't tell nuclear

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physics strokes.
Right.

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No like the.
Horror show, nobody is that, but

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what people do really like, and
I think this is one of the

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things that really helped me
grow as a comedian really

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quickly.
And this is true when I do my

223
00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:30,640
podcast, also true because they
have a podcast.

224
00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:34,080
I'll do a shout out to that.
But I think one of the things

225
00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:37,480
people really liked is if you do
sex strokes from a dirty point

226
00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:42,160
of view, like very like people
really respond to that because

227
00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:45,080
for a lot of reasons, like 1 is
they like saying, Oh yeah,

228
00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:48,040
scientists have real lives too,
you know, like they have

229
00:11:48,080 --> 00:11:51,560
romantic lives.
And and also just like they're

230
00:11:51,560 --> 00:11:55,440
so used to cold, dry academics
not doing that.

231
00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:58,040
It just, you know, it just
works.

232
00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:03,080
Yeah, definitely so.
I definitely don't never do it

233
00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:06,120
for the point of I'm not trying
to do a shock comic or something

234
00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:10,760
like I can say penis 27 times.
Like that's not the ever the

235
00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:12,400
point.
And there's plenty of comedians

236
00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:15,360
who do who can pull that off.
But that's not the point.

237
00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:17,000
I do.
But you know, I can make a kind

238
00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:18,760
of Lingus joke or something, you
know?

239
00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:19,840
Yeah.
Wow, that's a big word.

240
00:12:21,560 --> 00:12:23,360
OK, well, you got to use what
you got, I guess, right?

241
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:24,400
That's.
A.

242
00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,560
Big word, by the way.
I wanted to amend something.

243
00:12:28,560 --> 00:12:31,920
I told you the other day that I
met that I got your name from

244
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,240
Grok.
I I misspoke.

245
00:12:34,560 --> 00:12:36,160
I misspoke.
I apologize.

246
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:39,640
I got your name from a book I
was reading called Superheroes

247
00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:44,800
Movies in the State and and it
mentioned that you were a

248
00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:48,200
scientific consultant on the
movie Thor and in a.

249
00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:52,840
Book.
In a book I can send you the

250
00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:55,400
book if you would like.
It's it's a guy named Tom

251
00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:57,640
Sucker.
And there was who I did a

252
00:12:57,640 --> 00:13:00,000
podcast with and I forgot the Co
author's name.

253
00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:08,360
I have to get back to actually I
put it up and and you and your

254
00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:09,720
name came up and I and I said,
you know what?

255
00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:15,480
I need more scientists that are
going to be more like that keeps

256
00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,280
signs like almost the way that
you're describing that you tell

257
00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:21,120
jokes in a way that makes it
relatable as opposed to very cut

258
00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:23,800
and dry and kind of break the
stereotypes about that.

259
00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:25,440
And I wanted to talk to people
that were like that.

260
00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:28,000
So I I I asked rock for people
like you.

261
00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,960
And so that that that was where
the where the confusion was.

262
00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:34,240
But yes, Tom Sucker and Tricia
Jenkins.

263
00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,440
Try to talk you out of it.
It was like, no, no, no, you got

264
00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:38,080
to stick with him.
You got to stick with him.

265
00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:42,200
No, I, no, I, I just, I, I, I
was going through because it's a

266
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,120
very well sourced book.
It's written almost like an

267
00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:46,320
enormous college essay, like the
same kind of style.

268
00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:48,360
I would have written a college
essay just for a whole book.

269
00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,560
And they have a lot of sources
and references.

270
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,600
And so I was just looking up the
sources and references to see

271
00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:56,960
who would be interesting guests.
And and that's, that's like,

272
00:13:57,480 --> 00:13:59,880
yes.
Yes, so I was a science advisor

273
00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:02,960
and set decorator for Thor.
Not credited.

274
00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:04,920
I should say I'm on the
Wikipedia page, but.

275
00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:05,880
I'm.
Not how they're happy because.

276
00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:07,040
How does that work?
Because.

277
00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:12,360
I am not union.
So really, credit only goes to

278
00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:15,600
union members.
Yeah, which is that's changing.

279
00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:18,360
I think that's changing some.
Some people are doing good job.

280
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:22,680
Kip Thorne is really insistent
on, he's been helpful with

281
00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,440
trying to make sure that science
advisors get credit or at least

282
00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:29,200
mentioned didn't necessarily
have to get like a credit

283
00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:31,240
credit, but like a special
thanks to or something.

284
00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:34,520
We didn't.
There were four of us and we did

285
00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,480
not get a special thanks or
anything, which is a little

286
00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:40,720
frustrating, but it's OK.
I'm on the Wikipedia page and

287
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:41,520
that's better.
So.

288
00:14:42,560 --> 00:14:44,040
Yeah, right, right.
It's wider reaching I bet.

289
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:47,960
Yeah, yeah.
But yeah, So what I worked on

290
00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:49,840
for that, so that that's similar
to comedy.

291
00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:51,760
I mean, I like I said, I like, I
love Hollywood.

292
00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:55,400
I've I've been a science
consultant for lots of smaller

293
00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,160
projects.
That's the biggest one I've I've

294
00:14:57,160 --> 00:14:59,280
been on.
But that one is like really far

295
00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:00,840
reaching.
It's like that's a lifetime

296
00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:03,400
credit that I'm very proud of
because what I worked on there

297
00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:09,960
was I helped turn Jane Foster's
character from, she was

298
00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:11,520
originally in the comics, a
nurse.

299
00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:14,840
They wanted to modernize it a
little bit and make it a little

300
00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:16,920
more interesting, play more into
the story.

301
00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:23,640
And I helped turn her into a
nuclear astrophysicist who was

302
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,600
and there was an entire back
story behind the entire thing.

303
00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:28,040
Oh yeah.
Can you I?

304
00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,960
Wrote the whole back story for
why the set was decorated in the

305
00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:34,960
way it was.
I I she she had a lab in New

306
00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,720
Mexico and I helped set the
whole thing up.

307
00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,840
It's like I picked out all the
equipment and I think the thing

308
00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:46,120
I'm most proud of is in is that
she had a detector, a really big

309
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,160
detector.
And there's is featured several

310
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:50,280
times throughout the movie in
the background.

311
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:54,280
So one is it's like there's a
great scene where Kip Thorne is

312
00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:57,560
standing shirtless in front of
my detector.

313
00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:01,360
So that that's, that's anytime I
share that on social media, like

314
00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:04,200
I get a bunch of ladies going
like, because I'll say you can

315
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:06,120
see in the background my
detector, you know, it's like

316
00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:08,400
featured there, like all these
ladies are like what?

317
00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:13,360
And the what now, what with her
shirt off and everything.

318
00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:18,840
And, and then also there's all
this other equipment around the

319
00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:21,800
room and stuff and, and the
things in her car when she's off

320
00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:25,040
searching for these wormholes.
But there's a whole back story

321
00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:27,560
there, which is why a nuclear
astrophysicist would be looking

322
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:30,240
for a Rainbow Bridge.
That seems very strange, but

323
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,880
this ties into interstellar a
little bit.

324
00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:40,280
OK, that if if the if the
wormhole, if the Rainbow Bridge

325
00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:43,320
was a wormhole, which is our
best on way of understanding it,

326
00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:46,800
it would require very advanced
technology and particularly to

327
00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:49,400
keep the wormhole open.
So there's some mathematical

328
00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,880
reasons why this this was first
published in a paper by Kip

329
00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:56,640
Thorne about how to make a
wormhole stable.

330
00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,720
How do you make a How do you
turn on Einstein Rosen Bridge

331
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,520
into a transversible wormhole
and.

332
00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,160
A sentence here in the Marvel
movie.

333
00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:10,680
Yeah, exactly.
And the way you you do that is

334
00:17:10,680 --> 00:17:14,319
you have to line it with very
advanced material and you have

335
00:17:14,319 --> 00:17:16,480
to keep it stable because it
wants to collapse.

336
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:19,480
And the fact that it wants to
collapse is why in the movie

337
00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:21,400
Interstellar, when they go
through the wormhole, you see

338
00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:25,160
waves on the surface.
That's the advanced technology

339
00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,680
keeping the thing from
collapsing because naturally it

340
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,120
wants to collapse and pinch off
and turn into a black hole.

341
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:38,800
And so so because it is involves
advanced technology, I knew that

342
00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,760
that meant it probably involved
advanced particle physics.

343
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:45,120
And advanced particle physics
probably means very high energy

344
00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:48,440
particles are released and yet
undiscovered.

345
00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:53,040
But theorized particle is
something called a WIMP that

346
00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:55,480
makes dark matter so dark matter
particles.

347
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:59,920
And so I made her detector based
on a dark matter detector.

348
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:02,560
And normally these dark matter
detectors have to be in very

349
00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:05,840
quiet environments, buried miles
underground so that there's no

350
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,560
radiation from the, from space
or anything.

351
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:12,600
But the back story is that while
she was originally researching

352
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:16,040
dark matter, she kept getting
these insanely bright dark

353
00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:18,440
matter signals coming from New
Mexico.

354
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,160
And they were so bright, she
could even have the the detector

355
00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,400
above ground.
And so she picked up everything

356
00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,160
and moved it to Mexico and was
like looking for this dark

357
00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,520
matter signals coming out of out
of that of.

358
00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:32,920
Wow and.
That's what letter to New

359
00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:34,720
Mexico.
So that whole story, and I wrote

360
00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:38,000
that all up, it's so Kenneth
Brenner could could see it and

361
00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:40,200
everything.
So, but it's if they don't say

362
00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:42,080
it, which is fine.
I mean, I actually prefer that

363
00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:45,560
because what's nice is there's a
lot of thought behind it and you

364
00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:47,600
get the idea.
You know the story is about a

365
00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:51,480
dorse God, so you don't have to.
You know, it's not a Neil de

366
00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:53,280
Crest Tyson lecture or
something.

367
00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:55,600
So.
Yeah, but you know what it adds?

368
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:02,240
It adds a level, adds an
additional layer of intention or

369
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,280
thoughtfulness that that I guess
otherwise wouldn't have existed.

370
00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,240
You know, and you know, and
again, you know, part of that

371
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:11,000
point that at least in the book
that he was arguing was that,

372
00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:15,840
you know, and Marvel movies as a
whole went through like they

373
00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,480
kind of go back and forth
between using science as the

374
00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:23,800
solution to the to problems that
rise up as opposed to warfare,

375
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:25,440
as opposed to something
military.

376
00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:29,040
And then and they and they keep
on going back and forth between

377
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:30,480
the two.
So Ant Man and the Wasp or Ant

378
00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:34,240
Man movies are, you know, the
the premise and the actual like

379
00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:39,040
all the the savings of the days
are done with using science to

380
00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:42,440
solve problems, as opposed to
Captain Marvel, which would be

381
00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,320
just enormous space warfare and
blowing things up, you know, and

382
00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:50,040
and prevent and presenting both,
you know, and for the people to

383
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:52,240
kind of be excited by and turned
on by.

384
00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:55,720
Yeah, and Antman had really good
science consulting too.

385
00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:59,240
I didn't work on that one, but I
have a podcast interview with

386
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:01,480
the science consultant for that.
Cool.

387
00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:05,840
And part of the reason that it
was so good in that is that why

388
00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:07,280
am I blanking on his name?
What's Antman?

389
00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:10,000
The actors name.
What?

390
00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:12,560
Paul Rudd.
Paul Rudd Yeah, yeah, my buddy

391
00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:13,720
one.
Of the reasons I was really good

392
00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:18,080
in that is Paul Rudd really
wanted to understand it and he

393
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:21,320
spent a lot of time with the
salt science consultant himself,

394
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:24,560
which is not the case with Thor.
I was not, I never met Natalie

395
00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:28,280
Portman once.
Then yeah, there's the a bunch

396
00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:31,880
of the, the crew wanted me to
because I was there the same day

397
00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:35,120
that she was going to film.
And I won't say who, but the

398
00:20:36,120 --> 00:20:39,200
there was a higher up who said
no, no, no, that kid, that's not

399
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,560
going to happen because she was
really worried about the

400
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:43,800
director, Kenneth Burner,
getting mad that there were

401
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:47,320
other people on set and very
protective of the stars.

402
00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:49,760
I wish I had met her.
I think it might have gone even

403
00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:50,480
better.
I don't know.

404
00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:53,800
But I I've actually never met
her once.

405
00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:56,320
Wow, you know I.
Was on set when she was there,

406
00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:57,920
but I didn't get to meet her
there.

407
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,880
They're very secretive about
that for all sorts of reasons.

408
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,160
One is to protect the actors
being mobbed or whatever, but

409
00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,480
also they have even business
reasons why they do it.

410
00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:11,560
They're even protected from the
crew of what there's their

411
00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:13,080
costumes are and stuff like
that.

412
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,600
Because apparently sometimes
people leak photos and then they

413
00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:19,960
turn, they sell them to China
and they turn into knock off

414
00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,680
action figures and.
Stuff and how?

415
00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:25,320
People leak it and then ruin the
plot.

416
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:27,720
So they, they have a lot of like
business reasons why they're

417
00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:29,440
really protective about it too,
so.

418
00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:33,520
Have you are you aware of the
cute that, like the Legos, the

419
00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:37,400
Lego world gives away little
hints in advance to to the other

420
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:40,400
movies or plots based on the
heads that they release?

421
00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:42,240
Yeah, it's very cute.
I don't know what kind of

422
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:43,520
collaboration they have, but
I've never.

423
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:44,480
Heard of that.
Hey, Yeah.

424
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,040
Yeah, something to look into.
So, so walk me through what is

425
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:49,360
how'd you, how'd that even
happen?

426
00:21:49,360 --> 00:21:50,640
How did you end up as a
consultant?

427
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:54,320
Walk me through what do they
call you and say, hey, we need a

428
00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:55,480
consultant?
We have a script.

429
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:57,280
We don't have a script yet.
We're working on it, but we need

430
00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:58,600
help with the premise how that
was.

431
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:04,080
A great story too.
So I like this one because so I

432
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:05,800
can tell you what happened on
the back end first.

433
00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:09,240
So they went through.
So Kenneth Branagh worked on

434
00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,840
Frankenstein that he those Thor
was the second movie they

435
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:13,200
directed.
He worked on.

436
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,160
Frankenstein and he thought
because it's Frankenstein, who

437
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:17,760
cares if the science is
accurate?

438
00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:21,480
You know, he, he was like, and
he was actually felt really bad

439
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,480
about it because apparently
people ripped it apart and

440
00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:28,440
thought it was like not
believable and everything and,

441
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:32,280
and just trying to be an art
piece and people, you know,

442
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:33,960
some, some people don't like
that.

443
00:22:34,120 --> 00:22:36,280
So he felt really embarrassed
about that.

444
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:40,000
So he, he said he wanted to make
sure the science was correct in

445
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:41,480
this.
So he went to something called

446
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:45,120
the Science and Entertainment
exchange, which is started by

447
00:22:45,120 --> 00:22:49,280
Jerry Zucker.
And I have a podcast episode

448
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,960
where I interviewed Jerry Zucker
about it too.

449
00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,760
Yeah, because, because I wanted.
To talk to him about the Science

450
00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:57,320
Entertainment Exchange.
Anyway.

451
00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,600
So one of the things they
science entertainment exchanges,

452
00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,560
it allows Hollywood directors
and producers to reach out to

453
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,640
them and then have them get
advice from real academics, you

454
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:12,640
know, people like Caltech, UCLA,
that kind of thing in the in the

455
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,760
LA area.
So I suppose they don't have to

456
00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,480
be in the LA area.
That's usually usually what it

457
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:20,960
is.
So, but that's not how I found

458
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,120
out about it.
I found, I mean, that's that's

459
00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:25,280
what it led to me finding out
about, but that's definitely not

460
00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:27,520
what I responded to.
I told you that I work on

461
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,520
smaller projects all the time.
I just like being entertaining

462
00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:32,240
and I like science fiction a
lot.

463
00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:37,400
Sure, like a lot and I get so so
an e-mail was sent out to all

464
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,880
the grad students at Caltech,
all of them saying, hey, there's

465
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,800
this company, they have a
project or these producer, they

466
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,360
have a project and they're
hoping to get some scientists

467
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:49,960
who wants to some physicist who
wants to help give advice to

468
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:53,840
this project.
And there's no mention of Marvel

469
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:57,240
or Thor or Disney or any oh, it
wasn't owned by Disney at the

470
00:23:57,280 --> 00:23:59,520
time, but there's no mention of
anything like that.

471
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,360
It is very much was written in a
way to make it sound like it was

472
00:24:02,360 --> 00:24:04,320
a student project you.
Know OK.

473
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:07,000
You know, no pay and all that
kind of stuff.

474
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,320
It didn't say no pay, but I
mean, reading the e-mail, you'd

475
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:12,000
think I'm not going to get paid
for that.

476
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:14,680
So it was, it was really nice
because it was.

477
00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:18,920
So I responded, I was like, oh,
yeah, I'm super interested.

478
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:20,920
Oh oh, did I freeze?
Yeah.

479
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,360
You're here though, Yeah.
Yeah, so I, you know, I was

480
00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:27,280
super interested anyway because
I'm like, oh, I want to see

481
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:29,040
this.
So I met with the person and you

482
00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:31,960
know, even after the first
meeting I just didn't piece it

483
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:35,440
together and the only time.
What was the meeting out then?

484
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:37,520
How'd you what what?
What was the meeting that you

485
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:39,480
didn't?
I responded and I met with the

486
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:44,520
set decorator, Florence Feldman.
She she is credited, so I didn't

487
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:46,040
think that was my.
Direct boss.

488
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:49,520
She's unionized.
I met with her and she was

489
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:52,000
telling me about it.
And you know what's weird is I

490
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:54,160
wasn't even enough of a comic
book thing.

491
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,200
She did mention that the movie
was Thor, but I, I forgot.

492
00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,960
I mean, I knew about Thor, but I
wasn't, I'm not like I wasn't a

493
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:03,720
Super Avengers nerd or anything.
So I didn't piece it together.

494
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,360
I just didn't.
And it was only at the end she

495
00:25:07,360 --> 00:25:09,880
was telling me about the
character that I was going to be

496
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,800
trying to because she she was
going off of stuff that had

497
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:16,440
already been talked about with
Sean Carroll and Kevin, Peter

498
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,360
Hand and a few other people at
the script writing stage.

499
00:25:19,360 --> 00:25:22,440
So way earlier, that was before
the script was even, they were

500
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:24,440
sitting in a room saying we can
do it.

501
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:27,920
And she was saying, yeah, they
were suggesting that we turn

502
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,360
this into some sort of
scientist, maybe a physicist,

503
00:25:30,360 --> 00:25:33,320
maybe an Astro, an atmospheric
physicist.

504
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:36,160
They, they had several options
that she was some kind of

505
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,960
scientist studying something.
And that's when I, you know, I

506
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,200
was, I said, oh, I think nuclear
astrophysicist who detects A

507
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:46,040
wormhole would be really cool.
And, and they, they already knew

508
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:47,560
that the Rainbow Bridge was
going to be wormhole.

509
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:48,840
I would have come to the same
conclusion.

510
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:50,480
By the way.
But that wasn't my suggestion,

511
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:53,840
but that's what I would have
suggested.

512
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,520
And so she and then it was
relieving.

513
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:00,560
I was like, who did you say was
the actress who's playing this

514
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,920
again?
Or the And she kind of looked at

515
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:05,520
me because she had, I guess
she'd already said it.

516
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,480
And somehow I miss it.
And she's like Natalie Portman.

517
00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:12,200
Like, you know, she's not used
to people in Hollywood going

518
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:16,280
like, oh, who, who's on it?
You know, not freaking out at

519
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:17,480
that.
So funny.

520
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:19,720
Oh, oh, cool.
OK.

521
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:23,720
So funny, cool, so.
I, that was one of the first

522
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,920
things I asked is that I was
like, so why did you pick me?

523
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:29,760
Why did I get this?
And she goes, oh, you were the

524
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:31,360
only one who responded to the
e-mail.

525
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:35,000
Wow.
Really.

526
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:38,640
But, you know, they didn't say,
hey, work on this big Hollywood.

527
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:41,360
I bet.
I bet that's smarter them

528
00:26:41,360 --> 00:26:44,880
though, you know, I mean,
especially for like, you know,

529
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:48,000
they'll see who's in it for the
love of the game #1 and #2 is.

530
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,840
If they said this was for Thor
and a big Paramount movie then

531
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,120
they'd have to sort through
thousands of applicants I

532
00:26:54,120 --> 00:26:55,800
imagine.
Yeah, I didn't even know that

533
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:57,400
she was from Marvel.
It took me.

534
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,080
It was like the third meeting
that I realized she.

535
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:00,680
Was wow because.
Crazy.

536
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,520
A really common thing in
Hollywood to do is you you

537
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,480
create a corporation for each
movie.

538
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,440
And this is for legal reasons.
So if if something horrible

539
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,080
happens and they get sued, it
doesn't bankrupt the whole

540
00:27:12,120 --> 00:27:13,560
studio.
And then there's just a lot of

541
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:15,920
legal what?
So she handed me like this

542
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:19,000
business card that says like AAA
productions or something like

543
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:20,120
that.
You know, it's all very

544
00:27:20,120 --> 00:27:22,000
secretive.
And they're secretive up until

545
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:23,480
when they're filming and
everything.

546
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,920
So everything's very secretive.
I don't know.

547
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:29,040
Have you ever visited LA?
No, it's actually one of the few

548
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:30,920
big cities in America I have not
been to yet.

549
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,520
I'll just tell your, your
viewers about this, your

550
00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:36,880
listeners.
So in LA there's these signs,

551
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,440
these yellow signs.
They have arrow, an arrow

552
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:41,840
pointing somewhere and they have
text written on the top and

553
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:43,880
bottom.
And that's a really common sight

554
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:48,240
around LA and they're pointing
to something and it's their

555
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,240
directions for the crew to of a
movie being shot on location.

556
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:54,800
So it's a really common thing to
see throughout LA because we

557
00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:57,920
have film all over anything
within a 30 mile radius of

558
00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:01,480
Hollywood is is on location.
So you can see these a lot.

559
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,040
And they usually have some
cryptic name.

560
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:06,880
And that name is usually the
code name for the project.

561
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:11,040
Because if they just said like,
you know, like like Thor or Iron

562
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:13,880
Man or something, then it would
have exactly the wrong effect.

563
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:15,200
It doesn't tell the crew where
to park.

564
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:16,560
It tells where everyone else in
LA.

565
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:20,400
So, so that usually it's the
name of the, the company or

566
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:22,360
something or the code name of
the the project.

567
00:28:22,360 --> 00:28:26,120
So, so it's all very secretive
and, and, and you don't know if

568
00:28:26,120 --> 00:28:29,400
it's a big production or, or
nothing, you know, right.

569
00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:31,960
So it's, it's, and it's all
designed to make sure that

570
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,440
people are just like, go, you
know, TMZ doesn't show up with

571
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:38,640
helicopters and stuff like that.
Yeah, that relationship between

572
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:42,560
Hollywood's attempt at privacy
and the media is a has been a

573
00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,520
complicated one forever, but
it's kind of fun to be an

574
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,320
observant.
I gave her contribution to Thor,

575
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:52,440
my absolute favorite that I'm
most excited about was also very

576
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:56,000
secretive because Florence
contacted me like the night

577
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:58,640
before something was due.
She's like Kevin, Oh my God, we

578
00:28:58,680 --> 00:28:59,960
are in the next two days or
something.

579
00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:01,840
She's like, we need this really
fast.

580
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,760
We need these like 5 notebooks
and they need.

581
00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,600
And I was like, OK.
And she's like, and you need to

582
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,720
write equations in it and write
all kinds of stuff in it that's

583
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:15,080
sort of related to what you were
talking about, you know, and we

584
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:18,880
need 5 identical copies.
And I was like, and, and I was

585
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,080
like, OK, she's like, this is
just for the background, so

586
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:22,520
don't worry about it.
It's just for the background.

587
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:24,920
But you know, so that the
details of the equations doesn't

588
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:26,880
matter much and stuff.
But you know, we need this

589
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,120
really.
So I went out and I, I said,

590
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,080
well, I'm going to base it on
the kind of notebook I write,

591
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:34,800
which is a moleskin.
And so I went to the Caltech

592
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:38,280
bookstore and bought 5 moleskins
and I made five identical copies

593
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:40,680
of this.
And to this day, I wish I had

594
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:44,400
made six if I had, because she
was so secret about it.

595
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:46,280
She made it sound like it was
just something in the

596
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:48,680
background, like maybe it would
be on a desk open.

597
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:50,920
And it was actually Natalie
Portman's notebook, which is

598
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:53,880
like a major plot element.
No and.

599
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,960
Like they're sitting there
talking about they go out and

600
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,720
they go find the notebook.
They have to break into Shield

601
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:01,600
to get the notebook.
If I had known that, I would

602
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,800
have made a copy and that'd
probably be like, I could

603
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:05,560
probably sell it on eBay for
something.

604
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:07,240
Oh, sure.
Are you kidding me?

605
00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:08,720
That'd be so cool.
That's.

606
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,880
All my, you know, I wrote that
notebook and those exact same

607
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,040
kind of notebook I use that I
write real equations in, you

608
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:19,400
know, for, for myself and I even
had a bunch of stuff about

609
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:23,720
Hubble in there.
I put some clips from Hubble and

610
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:26,640
somehow that made it into the
the script.

611
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:28,640
So even though the script had
already been written, that just

612
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,680
the fact that it appeared in
there, he Chris Hemsler said

613
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:34,960
like he makes a joke about he's
like you're hubel or something

614
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:35,480
like that.
I.

615
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,120
Don't remember.
Totally caused that because I'm

616
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,480
the one who put the stuff about
Hubble in there and stuff.

617
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,320
That's so funny.
Wow.

618
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:45,400
I love that.
I love to hear these stories.

619
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:47,680
That's that's that's really why
I wanted to bring this up

620
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:50,200
actually, because I think these
stories are so cool.

621
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,200
It's so much the only.
Thing you told me that it's even

622
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:54,520
in a book is that's one of the
reasons I'm really happy I

623
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:58,520
worked on is I get so much like
attention just from that one

624
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:01,760
project.
Yeah, that that to me that feels

625
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:03,680
like timeless and everything and
like.

626
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:05,160
It is.
It is, man.

627
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:08,960
I mean Thor.
Thor is a foundational part of a

628
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:12,720
multi billion dollar franchise,
you know, and I mean, that's

629
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:14,920
like, that's incredible.
That's really cool.

630
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,120
That's having a real piece in
American entertainment history.

631
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:19,840
Definitely and.
I think that's one of the

632
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:22,520
reasons why movies like that
should have science consulting

633
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,720
because well, you know, sure,
you can argue, oh, 90% of the

634
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:28,200
people won't know that it's a
mistake.

635
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:32,120
The fact is it's very 4th wall
breaking for the 10% that no,

636
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:36,960
it's not right.
It's really annoying for the 1%

637
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,520
that are also part of, you know,
maybe they know a lot about

638
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:44,400
nuclear physics or astrophysics
or something and those guys go

639
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:46,480
online and say how dumb it is if
it's wrong.

640
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:49,280
So and that, that ends up
ruining it for everybody, you

641
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:51,960
know, like everybody's like, and
even if you're not an expert,

642
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:54,840
you can just kind of tell when
something doesn't sound right.

643
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:55,520
Sure.
You can just.

644
00:31:55,840 --> 00:32:00,480
Kind of tell, you know, you
know, maybe you flip through the

645
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,200
Science Channel a couple of
times or something.

646
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,080
You're just like, that doesn't
sound like it can work.

647
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,360
Yeah.
So funny, so funny.

648
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:12,840
I want to, I want to spend some
time on the actual, on some

649
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:16,040
actual science now and then I
want to surf back at the end,

650
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,800
hopefully the last maybe 1520
minutes and talk about your

651
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:23,120
favorite and most, most and
least accurate Hollywood

652
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,560
portrayals of science and stuff
like that.

653
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,840
I think I was even.
Thinking of making some like

654
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,320
video clips about that like
reaction videos or?

655
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:32,160
Something you should, you
should, you should.

656
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:34,920
That'd be so much.
Because I, I, you know, I

657
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,520
lecture my kids about these two
and it's kind of funny because

658
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:39,400
at this point they're like, we
know that, you know, Because

659
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,000
I'll say, what's wrong with
that?

660
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:43,440
Yeah, I love that.
OK, beautiful.

661
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:44,480
So let's get that.
Let's back to that.

662
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:49,000
But I want to get to the actual
nuclear physics because this is

663
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:54,040
a super hot topic, super fun
topic I think and has future

664
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,680
written all over it as far as I
understand.

665
00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:01,080
Can you actually?
I had a friend that sent in a

666
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:06,400
request and he's an engineer and
he asked isn't nuke just just a

667
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:09,520
steam engine with flair question
mark is it over Is it over

668
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,600
dramatic is what he asked.
Yeah.

669
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:14,480
I mean, it can't be traditional
nuclear.

670
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:16,560
Yeah, Yeah.
So that's definitely one of the

671
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:18,360
things I want to talk about
because I started a nuclear

672
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:19,600
company.
That's what I'm really.

673
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,240
Focused, please.
Let's let's so let's talk.

674
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:24,480
Let's talk about it, please.
So traditional nuclear is you,

675
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:28,480
you generate heat.
I mean, ultimately that's what a

676
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:31,000
nuclear reactor does.
It makes heat OK.

677
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:33,320
And you can.
And we have known since the

678
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:37,560
1940's, the mid 1940s very
dramatically demonstrated that

679
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:40,600
we can design A nuclear reactor
to run anywhere from room

680
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:43,480
temperature all the way up to
100,000,000°.

681
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:47,120
That's the upper limit.
There's really only one use for

682
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:49,440
running a nuclear reactor at 100
million degrees.

683
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:51,320
There's only one.
To blow things up.

684
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,240
Yeah, yeah, to blow up a city or
something like that.

685
00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:57,920
Now you can do interesting
things like that, like at 100

686
00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:01,040
million degrees, you can also
amplify fusion.

687
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,640
You can you can ignite fusion.
That's called thermonuclear

688
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:08,400
because it's hot enough that
even fusion starts working.

689
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,120
You can deliberate even more
energy that way.

690
00:34:10,639 --> 00:34:13,800
However, when you make a
fission, normal fission reactor,

691
00:34:14,159 --> 00:34:16,440
you just are.
You don't want it to be 100

692
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:18,400
million degrees.
You don't even want it to be

693
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:21,560
5000° because then the container
it's in would melt.

694
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,760
OK, so you you just want it hot
enough that you can get work out

695
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,120
of it.
And the hotter you get, the more

696
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:30,600
efficiently you can get that
work out.

697
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:34,800
But you're limited by the the
the container, not the reactor

698
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,040
itself.
So can I?

699
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,280
OK, got the.
Easiest thing to get energy, The

700
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,080
easiest way we know how to get
energy.

701
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:45,040
A very good process for getting
out energy is you boil water and

702
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:48,280
you drive a steam turbine.
That's a very efficient way of

703
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:52,239
getting work out of heat.
Gotcha.

704
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:55,560
Can I?
It's it's pretty simple.

705
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:57,920
It's like you take rocks, you
stick them next to each other

706
00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:59,320
and they get hot.
Right.

707
00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:03,480
That's nuclear right there.
So why is it more so much more

708
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,840
effective or efficient than than
anything else?

709
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,920
Like why is it the the energy
source of the future?

710
00:35:10,720 --> 00:35:15,080
Because of the what the cost of
that energy in the 1st place.

711
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,960
So all kinds of things, you can
get heat to boil steam using all

712
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,760
kinds of things.
Wood, take wood and you can boil

713
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:23,440
steam.
We've been doing that for for a

714
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,560
really long time.
And you can use coal, then you

715
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:28,480
move to coal.
You can use coal to boil steam.

716
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,360
That's how we powered trains in
the past, you know.

717
00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:39,400
And then you can also use, you
can use liquid hydrocarbons, you

718
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:41,920
know, oil and gas.
You can do that too you.

719
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:44,120
And again, you just boil steam
and use that.

720
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:48,080
The problem is that if you're
using something other than

721
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:52,320
nuclear, the size and the weight
of the thing you need to get

722
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:55,400
that energy is just enormous.
I see.

723
00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:58,480
And it's it's not a little bit
of a difference.

724
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,120
It's not even a close contest
per weight.

725
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,560
Nuclear has a million times more
energy per weight.

726
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:08,320
I mean a million times.
So, so to get the same amount of

727
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:13,520
energy as a ton of coal is a
speck speck of uranium.

728
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:17,000
That's where it comes into.
This is why it's the fuel of the

729
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:20,440
future is because the the
resource we care about in the

730
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,840
future is the Earth itself.
We live here, we want to live

731
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:28,160
here.
There's not a double planet out

732
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:33,280
there at the moment.
And the if, if we just consume

733
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:36,040
all the stuff that's on the
surface and use that for energy,

734
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:38,280
we're doing it very, very
inefficiently.

735
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:41,840
So even though it might seem
like the steam part is somehow

736
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,360
old fashioned or something,
that's not really what's

737
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,200
relevant.
What's relevant is where's that

738
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,560
energy coming from?
Like how, how efficient are we

739
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,560
getting that?
And nuclear is a million times

740
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:52,680
more efficient than that's one
of the reasons why a nuclear

741
00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:55,360
reactor, especially a nuclear
society that does this

742
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,440
regularly, they can get the
price of electricity lower and

743
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,320
lower and lower.
And by the way, the price of

744
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:06,960
nuclear is almost all driven by
safety and backups and concrete

745
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:09,720
and, and all these things that
have very little to do with the

746
00:37:09,720 --> 00:37:13,720
fuel itself.
And so in terms of, you know,

747
00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:17,440
mining for uranium is just way
more efficient than mining for

748
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,320
coal.
And then there's probably the

749
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:23,040
even more pressing.
Issue, which is OK, even if we

750
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:26,240
didn't mind pumping oil forever
and ever and ever, the fact is

751
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:28,960
the Earth's crust does not have
an infinite supply of oil.

752
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:33,200
Oil came from a biogeologic
process.

753
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,440
Biology is not infinite.
Even when you go back millions

754
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:40,720
of years, there were not, there
was not just a a pile and pile

755
00:37:40,720 --> 00:37:43,400
and piles of dinosaurs, or you
know, it wasn't made from

756
00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:47,040
dinosaurs, but you get the idea.
You know it's, it was made from

757
00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:52,560
very specific events where plant
animals and plants and animals

758
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:55,600
in the ocean fell to the bottom
of the ocean and happened to get

759
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,800
covered by geology.
The number of spots where that's

760
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,480
happened is big, but it's not
infinite.

761
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,760
And we want a lot of energy.
And if we were going to go into

762
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:05,680
the future, we need more energy,
not less.

763
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:09,200
And you know, sometimes people
want to say, oh, we should just

764
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:12,120
stop using energy or we should
just go extinct or something

765
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:14,640
like that.
I'm personally not at all in

766
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,880
that camp.
I'm a very pro human person.

767
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,480
I think there's not enough
people really do.

768
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,160
I think one of the most
dangerous ideas in history is

769
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:25,360
that if you go back in history,
you can see the people talking

770
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,120
about saying there's too many
people are some of the worst

771
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:31,640
people in history.
And it's really important to

772
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:35,760
remember like the future can
have way more people, especially

773
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,200
if we start going to other
planets.

774
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:41,080
We can we can multiply the
number of people by 1000, you

775
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:45,320
know, in the next few 100 years
easily if we wanted to.

776
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,400
And that's going to take a lot
of energy because I don't want

777
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:50,280
it.
A bunch of, you know, I don't

778
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,920
want us to all be like starving
and huddling around a single

779
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:56,040
light bulb or something.
We all want spaceships and want

780
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,440
to travel and things like that.
So we're only going to be able

781
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:02,640
to do that with nuclear.
There's no other way of doing

782
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,240
it, period.
So, so what's the hesitancy?

783
00:39:06,240 --> 00:39:08,000
I know that there's a stigma
around it.

784
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:12,120
I know that there's and probably
and you know, I think there's a

785
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:14,880
phenomenon that, you know, when
something in the culture or

786
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:18,000
society gets an idea, you kind
of at a certain point you kind

787
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,280
of have to wait for that
generation to kind of die out or

788
00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:23,280
get too old and stop making the
choices for any changes to to

789
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:24,120
reasonably happen.
I.

790
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:26,560
Don't know if you have kids, but
I have kids, yeah.

791
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:31,760
And so when you see little kids,
you, you get to see something

792
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,960
because part of being a parent
is like introducing your kids to

793
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:38,400
scary things, but not trying to
scare them, you know, So this is

794
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:42,200
one of the reasons why movies
start off as cartoons, but they

795
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,280
have a scary scene and then they
get scarier than by the time

796
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:48,920
you're in junior high or high
school, you're like, I want to

797
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,920
see slasher movies and stuff
like that.

798
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,400
And then you want to see stuff
that's dark and stuff.

799
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:59,520
And part of that is because, you
know, the way you get you, you

800
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:02,720
stop being afraid of something
is you see a scary side of it

801
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:05,480
and then realize it's not bad
that you survived.

802
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:06,960
Oh, oh, I know how to survive
that.

803
00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:10,320
This is probably also why we get
nightmares, you know, our brain

804
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,560
practicing in case something
scary happens.

805
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,640
And I think civilization goes
through that too.

806
00:40:15,720 --> 00:40:19,920
I mean, the fact is the first
example of nuclear was scary.

807
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:22,920
The very first moment that no
one had any idea what it was.

808
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:24,880
The vast majority of people on
the planet Earth.

809
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:29,480
Had no idea what nuclear physics
was even certainly didn't know

810
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:32,680
about nuclear fission because it
was a very closely guarded

811
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:34,920
secret.
And when they found out that was

812
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:39,240
terrifying and it it should have
been terrifying because that

813
00:40:39,240 --> 00:40:41,320
would I mean, that's why the
movie Oppenheimer is so great.

814
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:44,840
It's like it wasn't just about
like, you know, it wasn't all

815
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,920
shiny optimism like, Oh my God,
we figured out how to power

816
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:49,440
everything.
We also figured out how to

817
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:51,640
destroy everything.
The 2GO together.

818
00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:56,120
You like, you know, Stanley used
to say, and they say in Marvel

819
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:58,640
movies, with great power comes
great responsibility, right?

820
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:01,800
So there has to be a so
civilization has to go through

821
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:03,760
that too.
They have to be scared of it a

822
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:08,120
little bit, you know, and
there's there's a great line in

823
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:10,120
opera room.
He says they won't fear it until

824
00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:12,120
they understand it and they
won't understand it until

825
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:15,160
they've used it, right.
Really good line because that's

826
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:16,960
true.
It's like you, you have to have

827
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:20,800
a fear of nuclear power and in
order to not fear it.

828
00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:23,400
It sounds ironic, but it, and
this is one of the reasons why

829
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:27,240
the most pro nuclear people tend
to be nuclear physicists.

830
00:41:27,240 --> 00:41:30,240
Most, you know, across the
board, I think I've met like

831
00:41:30,240 --> 00:41:33,520
maybe 3 anti nuclear power
nuclear physicists in my entire

832
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:35,600
life.
And they're part of the reason

833
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,120
is because we, you know, our job
is to understand it.

834
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:41,160
We go around with detectors, we
see that like, oh, wait a

835
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:43,760
minute, radiation isn't this
like unusual thing?

836
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:45,400
It's actually in this room right
now.

837
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:48,000
This room is radioactive.
You know, when you, once you

838
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:50,160
start playing around with a
Geiger counter for 5 minutes,

839
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:52,920
you realize like, oh, I didn't
know concrete was radioactive.

840
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,240
That's weird.
You know, the city I've been

841
00:41:55,240 --> 00:41:56,560
parking extra at this whole
time.

842
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:02,760
So, you know, so we it's it's
civilization has to go through

843
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:05,160
that too.
And we've had, you know, scares

844
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,720
like Chernobyl and then
Fukushima and those that that

845
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:11,400
caused us to back away.
I'm not sure this is the right

846
00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:14,240
way.
But like all things that where

847
00:42:14,240 --> 00:42:16,840
you're first scared of
something, you say, well, oh, if

848
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:19,240
we just fix this, then that can
never happen again.

849
00:42:19,240 --> 00:42:20,960
If we fix this, that can never
happen again.

850
00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:24,400
And we, you know, what's what's
funny, what's not funny, but

851
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:26,600
what's interesting about
Chernobyl is we had already

852
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:29,440
anticipated the mistake that
Chernobyl might have had.

853
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:33,640
And no new reactors being built
at the time of Chernobyl had

854
00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:36,120
that flaw.
I mean, that that flaw had been

855
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:38,280
engineered out a long time ago.
Wow.

856
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:40,320
It doesn't change the fact that
it was still running.

857
00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,880
And then on top of it, the
Soviets kind of covered up that

858
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:44,440
the accident even happened and
stuff.

859
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,720
So.
Can you give a quick rundown of

860
00:42:46,720 --> 00:42:48,760
what happened just in case
anyone doesn't know it?

861
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,000
Well, it's really complicated,
which is how most nuclear

862
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:53,800
accidents happen.
There's usually it's, it's

863
00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:55,520
definitely not like everything's
fine.

864
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:57,640
And then you know the.
Reactor does not.

865
00:42:57,920 --> 00:42:59,720
Yeah, sure, that.
Doesn't happen because they are

866
00:42:59,720 --> 00:43:02,600
very well engineered and they
don't just happen.

867
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:07,160
What causes accidents is either
some natural event of

868
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:13,920
extraordinary infrequency
happens, or a sequence of events

869
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:17,440
over several days leads up to
people not knowing the state

870
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:19,880
that the reactors in.
So Chernobyl was the second

871
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:23,800
type.
It was combined by the fact that

872
00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:27,600
people had done some experiments
the day earlier and we're doing

873
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:29,640
another experiment the day
later.

874
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:33,080
And they had altered the state
of the reactor in a way that

875
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:35,960
didn't, that wasn't obvious to
the people conducting the second

876
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,400
experiment.
And they overreacted to what

877
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:40,440
they thought was happening and
they made a mistake.

878
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:43,440
I see in that.
And that's one of the things

879
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:48,320
that is also not going to happen
with modern reactors because we

880
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:53,440
can, we can run simulations of
very unusual estates and

881
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:57,440
processes on a computer and we
can train, we can do things like

882
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:03,200
train AI to, to point out
unusual situations to maybe even

883
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,480
maybe a crew is that they're
brand new to it.

884
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:07,760
They're not that, you know,
they're not as experienced or

885
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:10,320
something, or they have a boss
who's saying, no, just do it,

886
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,000
it's fine or something.
That which is what happened in

887
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:14,760
Chernobyl.
Like, you know, they were being

888
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:17,760
told, you know, don't worry
about it was a it was a crew in

889
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,160
the middle of the night.
They shouldn't have been doing

890
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:21,840
an experiment in the middle of
the night that they were.

891
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:29,280
But but what happened there was
xenon gas built up and xenon has

892
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:30,960
different properties with
neutrons.

893
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:34,040
It it eats them.
OK, so it made it look like

894
00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:35,520
this.
So they kept pulling the control

895
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:40,360
rods out because they kept
thinking the that the reactor

896
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:42,960
was not working right.
That wasn't the way they should

897
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,920
have packed it up.
They thought like, oh, pull them

898
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:47,440
out more, pull them out more.
That should have been an alarm

899
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:50,040
bell to them is like pulling
your control rod out of a

900
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:54,280
reactor should not like the
reactor should go get warmer

901
00:44:54,280 --> 00:44:56,760
when that happens and the salute
the answer that is not just pull

902
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,760
them out even further, but it
was the xenon that was doing it.

903
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:01,600
The problem is xenon also decays
away.

904
00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:06,280
This type of xenon decays away.
And so as the xenon was decaying

905
00:45:06,280 --> 00:45:07,840
away, the reactor suddenly
spiked.

906
00:45:08,240 --> 00:45:10,880
And then finally there were
this, this was a design flaw.

907
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,800
They put the react, the control
rods back in really quickly.

908
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:17,800
And those particular control
rods had a flaw where the little

909
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,280
section at the bottom actually
boosted the activity of the

910
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:23,400
reactor.
And so it, it, it that's, that's

911
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:25,040
what led to it going super
critical.

912
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:27,280
So it almost so all those things
are are.

913
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:32,080
Very solvable.
So cool down, and then the xenon

914
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,000
decayed, heated back up.
They shoved it back in, and in

915
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:36,960
the process of shoving it back
in, it heats up even more.

916
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:39,840
Yeah, because they saw, because
once the xenon went away, it

917
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:41,680
suddenly started spiking really,
really high.

918
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,480
And they were like quick, quick,
do something, you know, drop the

919
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:46,560
pro rods.
And that made it even worse.

920
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:49,040
Oh, my gosh.
And you said, you said that the

921
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:50,600
first way that it could happen
is there's a change in

922
00:45:50,600 --> 00:45:52,160
frequency.
What does that mean?

923
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:54,040
Is that like if there's like an
earthquake or something?

924
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,600
You said there's two ways for
there to be to cause a natural.

925
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,640
That a natural event that's very
infrequent.

926
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,200
Infrequent gotcha second.
Yeah, so.

927
00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,360
And when you design A nuclear
power plant, you have to

928
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:09,240
nowadays, you have to look at
really, really, really

929
00:46:09,240 --> 00:46:13,680
infrequent events.
And so examples of infrequent

930
00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:16,120
events are, well, let's start
with the obvious.

931
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:19,640
In the case of Fukushima, a
tsunami that happens only every

932
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:22,680
couple 100 years, although, you
know, honestly that location was

933
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:24,600
it was that infrequent.
So they should have been a

934
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:28,200
little better prepared.
But but you know, another one is

935
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:31,240
a major earthquake in an area
that doesn't have earthquakes.

936
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:33,520
You know, that's that, that
that's an example.

937
00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:38,880
Being hit by a meteor is an
example of war breaking out.

938
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:42,680
Even if you're in a peaceful,
you know, neutral country or

939
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:47,440
whatever you can, a war can
always break out a terrorist

940
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:49,280
attack.
These are like infrequent things

941
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:51,720
that can cause problems and you
have to be ready for those.

942
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:53,000
You have to take those into
account.

943
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:56,680
Before I pause for a 2 second
bathroom break, I want to leave

944
00:46:56,680 --> 00:47:00,560
you with a question and that is
because I want I don't want to

945
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:05,440
forget it while while we pause
is He said if a war breaks out,

946
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:08,520
I want to ask you about Iran's
potential new.

947
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:12,680
Let's just say for at face value
what they say it is, and if

948
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:16,480
there was a war you're going to.
Ask you about Zaparisia, which

949
00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:19,200
is a nuclear power plant being
fought over.

950
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:21,640
Well, I didn't even know about
that one, so you can tell me

951
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:23,560
about that too.
There's a war being fought over

952
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:25,760
2 reactors.
Chernobyl even is being fought

953
00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:26,560
over.
Chernobyl seed.

954
00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:31,080
It is a a crazy history man.
It had an accident and now

955
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,040
there's like a war being fought
over.

956
00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:36,840
So, okay, let's all the stuff
just I want to jump right back

957
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:37,480
into this.
Okay, great.

958
00:47:37,520 --> 00:47:39,920
All right, thank you.
Just curious.

959
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:44,200
Okay, we're back.
So the question that I had was,

960
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:48,520
and completely apolitically I
want to emphasize hypothetically

961
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:51,160
Iran or any country that's ever
working on enriching their

962
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:56,400
nuclear potential gets up to 40,
fifty, 60% enriched uranium.

963
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:57,320
I don't even know what that
means.

964
00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:00,800
So I understand that.
But then, you know, if you hear

965
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:04,280
that we have bunker Buster
strikes on those facilities or,

966
00:48:04,320 --> 00:48:07,440
you know, we're dropping bombs
on them, wouldn't that be that

967
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,040
change in environment that you
that you mentioned is risky or?

968
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:14,680
No.
If you if you bomb a running

969
00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:19,120
nuclear power plant, then yes,
But when you enrich your uranium

970
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:21,720
is naturally radioactive.
That's one of the reasons why

971
00:48:21,720 --> 00:48:24,400
concrete is radioactive actually
is because it contains thorium

972
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:26,800
and uranium.
And, and that's why you can go

973
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:28,720
up to a Geiger counter to
concrete and you'll get

974
00:48:28,720 --> 00:48:31,600
detections.
That's the uranium decaying, but

975
00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:35,840
it's very weakly radioactive,
and the reason is because it has

976
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:40,240
billions of years of half life,
which is why it's even around.

977
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:42,760
It wouldn't be naturally
occurring if it was older than

978
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:46,400
the Earth itself, but there's
two isotopes of uranium that

979
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:49,280
occur naturally that have
different half lives, both in

980
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:54,680
the billions of years.
There's 2:35 and 2:38 and you

981
00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:58,040
can build a nuclear reactor with
238, which is the most abundant

982
00:48:58,040 --> 00:49:01,720
uranium, but the only one
particular type of reactor you

983
00:49:01,720 --> 00:49:03,160
have to have a special reactor
can do.

984
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:05,560
Reactors in Canada are an
example.

985
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:08,600
So you can build a reactor like
that, but it's not the

986
00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:14,040
preference of the United States
or or Russia Canada like some.

987
00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:17,000
But that's because then they
don't have to be dependent on

988
00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:19,320
the United States for enriched
uranium and they don't have to

989
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:21,280
enrich it themselves.
And we don't want them to enrich

990
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,400
it.
We don't mind them having the

991
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:26,640
other reactor.
But but until you run the

992
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:30,720
reactor, just having uranium
spread around is not very

993
00:49:30,720 --> 00:49:33,040
dangerous.
It's, it's very mildly

994
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:35,040
dangerous.
You wouldn't want to inhale it

995
00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:38,360
like like if, if so this comes
up when it's used, sometimes

996
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:42,520
used in depleted uranium for
armor and stuff like that.

997
00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:44,960
Sometimes it's controversial.
Saddam Hussein was really big

998
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:47,440
and spreading all these.
He's trying to scare his people

999
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:50,440
about that, which is ironic
because he had a lot of depleted

1000
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:54,040
uranium armor in his vehicles.
But you know, he was trying to

1001
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,360
say it caused all these birth
defects and stuff like that.

1002
00:49:56,720 --> 00:49:59,520
I, I'm not going to get into the
politics of that, but I can just

1003
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:01,720
tell you that it's not very
radioactive.

1004
00:50:01,720 --> 00:50:05,880
So destroying a bunker that has
it already in it really doesn't

1005
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:07,840
do much.
In fact, most of it, especially

1006
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,280
if it's underground, it's sealed
underground.

1007
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:13,560
So it, it poses basically zero
risk to anybody.

1008
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:16,760
That's very different than once
you run as soon as you switch on

1009
00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:20,840
a nuclear reactor, the nuclei
when when fission occurs, nuclei

1010
00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:25,360
split in half and they beat they
split in half randomly 50.

1011
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:28,240
It's not exactly 5050.
They split one will be bigger,

1012
00:50:28,240 --> 00:50:31,320
one will be smaller.
And these two things that they

1013
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:36,720
make are there's, they're called
fission daughters and or fission

1014
00:50:36,720 --> 00:50:41,000
products is the more modern PC
one term.

1015
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:45,280
And these, these fission
daughters are themselves

1016
00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:48,000
typically unstable.
They have very short half lives.

1017
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,320
Some of them decay within
milliseconds.

1018
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:53,600
So this as soon as the fission
occurs, they immediately give

1019
00:50:53,600 --> 00:50:55,760
off their energy that
contributes to the energy of the

1020
00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:58,000
reactor.
But some of them last a really

1021
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:00,480
long time, some of the last 30
years, some of the last

1022
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:02,920
thousands of years, some of the
last 100,000 years.

1023
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:07,240
The ones that are the most
dangerous are the ones that last

1024
00:51:07,240 --> 00:51:10,000
between 1 and 30 years.
And this is because this is on

1025
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:15,040
the scale of a human lifetime.
So if those spread into an area,

1026
00:51:15,240 --> 00:51:18,600
they can fall on the ground and
they get absorbed in food and,

1027
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:20,840
and people might eat that food
and stuff like that.

1028
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:24,240
And, and they also scare people
the most because they're the the

1029
00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:26,760
most detectable.
They're more significantly more

1030
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:28,920
radioactive than natural
uranium.

1031
00:51:29,240 --> 00:51:32,240
And so you can walk around an
area anyway that when that

1032
00:51:32,240 --> 00:51:34,520
happens, when that stuff is
released in the environment,

1033
00:51:34,720 --> 00:51:37,120
it's called Fallout.
And it's called fallout for the

1034
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:40,960
very simple reason that as soon
as it's it's made, it falls out

1035
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,480
of the sky.
Now when you do something like

1036
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:46,240
do an air burst from a nuclear
bomb, just to show you how

1037
00:51:46,240 --> 00:51:50,120
little you know how not scary
fallout is, I mean, you should

1038
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:52,920
be scared of it immediately.
If an atom bomb goes off near

1039
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:56,240
your city, you should not try
and breathe the air as much as

1040
00:51:56,240 --> 00:51:57,800
possible.
You should wear a gas mask for

1041
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:00,520
several weeks.
But that's a side issue.

1042
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:07,240
But but years later that fallout
is is so is so small that it you

1043
00:52:07,240 --> 00:52:08,920
can't even tell.
Like if you walk around

1044
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:13,080
Hiroshima or Nagasaki, it it
does not have significant

1045
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:16,320
radiation there, you wouldn't,
it would be, you'd be very hard

1046
00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:19,720
pressed to know that an atom
bomb had gone off there years

1047
00:52:19,720 --> 00:52:22,320
and years later.
However, in the case of

1048
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:24,640
Chernobyl, quite a lot of
fallout was released.

1049
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:28,400
And it was released because the
reactor wasn't just, it wasn't

1050
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:30,360
actually the explosion that
spread the fallout.

1051
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:33,880
It was the fact that the reactor
was on fire for several days and

1052
00:52:33,880 --> 00:52:37,280
fire it was, it was burning with
the fallout and a lot of that

1053
00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:41,320
fallout was being lifted and
just spread and it just fell

1054
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:45,600
everywhere and huge amounts of
it were spread and landed on the

1055
00:52:45,600 --> 00:52:47,360
ground.
And that's what led to the

1056
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:50,720
exclusion zone, and the same
with Fukushima's exclusion zone.

1057
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:55,080
And how is there a way to
determine the lifespan of how,

1058
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:58,480
how long it's going to how long
one of these will last?

1059
00:52:58,480 --> 00:52:59,640
Or like, how do you know?
Oh.

1060
00:52:59,640 --> 00:53:01,480
Yeah, Yeah, it's super well
understood, yeah.

1061
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:03,800
Oh, really?
Oh yeah, we, we know the, the

1062
00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:06,520
yeah, we know.
We know the statistics on every

1063
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:09,280
Fallout doubt or that that was
known even in 1940.

1064
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:10,160
They knew that.
Really.

1065
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:11,520
Yeah.
So it's, so it's pretty

1066
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:14,240
tangible.
Yes, yeah, and very measurable.

1067
00:53:14,520 --> 00:53:17,360
And, and there's equipment that
not a Geiger counter, but a more

1068
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:19,560
sophisticated equipment,
something called a gamma

1069
00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:22,600
spectrometer, more expensive
piece of equipment.

1070
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:26,360
Yeah, sounds expensive.
Those can tell you exactly what

1071
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:28,680
is there.
You can say with incredible

1072
00:53:28,680 --> 00:53:31,840
accuracy what fallout is
present, what isotopes are

1073
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:33,480
present.
And it's, it's like a

1074
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:35,600
fingerprint and it's, it's very
easy to tell.

1075
00:53:36,360 --> 00:53:37,680
Wow.
So if so, if anything were to

1076
00:53:37,680 --> 00:53:42,280
happen, it would be very easy,
easy to identify, hey, this area

1077
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:46,200
is not safe for 30 seconds or
for three months or for 10

1078
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:48,000
years.
Yeah, that could be pretty easy

1079
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:49,160
to tell.
Absolutely.

1080
00:53:49,320 --> 00:53:51,000
Yeah, that's really interesting.
That's really cool.

1081
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:55,000
And it's it's also it's used
regularly as part of non

1082
00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:58,520
proliferation.
So, so to see if someone is

1083
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:02,200
testing nuclear weapons, for
example, we have very accurate

1084
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:04,160
many countries including.
The US because.

1085
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:08,560
Many very, very sensitive
detectors flying in all kinds of

1086
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:10,760
classified ways that I can't get
into.

1087
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:13,200
I don't have clearance, but I
wouldn't even.

1088
00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:15,040
I don't even want to talk about
it without that.

1089
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:19,880
But but, but, but we have very
sensitive detectors looking for

1090
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:22,400
that all the time because we're
not just looking for, you know,

1091
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,640
some really obvious nuclear
tests.

1092
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:27,520
We're looking for ones that are,
are underground and those don't

1093
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:28,720
release very much.
Follow those.

1094
00:54:28,720 --> 00:54:31,520
Those give little, tiny, little
whiffs, you know, and, and

1095
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:34,440
there's only certain radioactive
gases that can be given off.

1096
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,520
Krypton is a great example
because there's Krypton in the

1097
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:40,000
atmosphere right now and that is
all made by us.

1098
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:42,040
That is not a naturally
occurring thing.

1099
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,040
That really made.
Yeah, it is.

1100
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:45,560
Yeah.
It's made from all the nuclear

1101
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:48,800
weapons testing in the 50s and
60s and 70s and 80s.

1102
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:51,160
Is there any relationship to
that being?

1103
00:54:51,480 --> 00:54:55,160
Is that what the captain was?
Superman's, What do you call it?

1104
00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:57,240
Is.
Probably because it sounds cool.

1105
00:54:57,280 --> 00:54:59,560
You know, if it were, if it were
an everyday thing, it wouldn't

1106
00:54:59,560 --> 00:55:01,120
have sounded like an alien
planet.

1107
00:55:01,600 --> 00:55:04,880
Yeah, I said it could be that he
that he's, he's natural.

1108
00:55:04,880 --> 00:55:07,320
And this man made sub, this man
made substance kills him.

1109
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:08,040
You know this.
Yeah.

1110
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:10,800
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, Tell you, can you?

1111
00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:12,520
So tell me about these wars that
you mentioned that were

1112
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:13,880
happening over nuclear
facilities.

1113
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:17,160
Yeah, so the Ukraine Russia war,
they're fighting over the

1114
00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:20,800
Zaparisia plant and the.
So the Russians took over the

1115
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:26,000
Zaparisia plant, and they also
took over Chernobyl for and the.

1116
00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:28,440
Anyone talking about this?
When when when is this

1117
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:28,960
happening?
I've.

1118
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:31,640
I've done a news article.
Yeah, I, I did AI did an

1119
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:35,800
interview on TV for for TRT and
Turkish television, OK.

1120
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:39,280
And they asked specifically,
they said that like, hey, are

1121
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:43,280
we, you know, is this a danger?
And you know, so in the

1122
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,080
interview, I'll just repeat what
I said there.

1123
00:55:46,080 --> 00:55:52,000
It's like while it's a really
big, so Zaparisia is a really

1124
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:54,600
big nuclear power plant.
It's the largest in Europe.

1125
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:57,680
So it's very big.
It's it's six reactors sitting

1126
00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:01,600
next to each other, really big.
But at the same time, it was

1127
00:56:01,600 --> 00:56:04,800
also designed significantly
later than Chernobyl was

1128
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:06,360
designed.
In fact, it was being

1129
00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:08,800
constructed around the time the
Chernobyl accident happened.

1130
00:56:09,320 --> 00:56:16,280
And already they had known that
the risk of both the US and the

1131
00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:19,240
Soviet Union designed something
called a containment vessel

1132
00:56:19,240 --> 00:56:22,960
around a nuclear reactor.
And while it it this is a great

1133
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:25,760
example of how, you know,
there's a little bit of

1134
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:27,960
political spin.
It's called a containment vessel

1135
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:32,240
so that people focus on the fact
that it contains the fallout if

1136
00:56:32,240 --> 00:56:35,200
there's an accident inside.
But that's not the real reason

1137
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:37,200
why we're really, they're really
necessary.

1138
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:40,200
The main reason they're
necessary is because they keep

1139
00:56:40,240 --> 00:56:43,200
airplanes and missiles out.
That's its main function.

1140
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:46,680
That's why they're a, a, a
beater thick concrete.

1141
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:50,480
It is so that if somebody takes
an airplane and crashes it into

1142
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:52,920
it.
And by the way, pre 911, they

1143
00:56:52,920 --> 00:56:55,000
were already thinking about this
long before 911.

1144
00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:56,880
They're probably planning it.
No, I don't.

1145
00:56:57,440 --> 00:57:01,560
It won't go there.
I've gone down a different

1146
00:57:01,560 --> 00:57:06,440
episodes.
Yeah, but that is, it is both

1147
00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:09,840
the Soviet Union and America did
very detailed tests where the

1148
00:57:09,840 --> 00:57:12,680
Soviet Union took the kind of
containment vessels around

1149
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:15,280
Zaparia.
They put a giant steel beam in a

1150
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:19,000
giant passenger jet and crashed
it into a test facility to see

1151
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:20,880
what it survived.
And it does.

1152
00:57:20,880 --> 00:57:22,000
It does.
It survived.

1153
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:26,240
It's actually very difficult to
intentionally destroy a nuclear

1154
00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,320
reactor.
That's why even if there's a war

1155
00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:33,280
outside, you know you're it's
it's not that bad.

1156
00:57:33,520 --> 00:57:37,000
What's what the danger is is
that old designs are not

1157
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:40,360
passively safe meaning, and this
is a big difference between old

1158
00:57:40,360 --> 00:57:43,920
designs and advanced nuclear.
We all know we know how to do

1159
00:57:43,920 --> 00:57:47,320
passive safety now because one
of the biggest risks is always

1160
00:57:47,560 --> 00:57:49,720
the people themselves.
And I don't mean if they're

1161
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:52,720
trustworthy.
I mean, the fact is a risk is

1162
00:57:52,720 --> 00:57:56,640
what if an army or a terrorist
group or whoever storms the

1163
00:57:56,640 --> 00:58:01,960
control room and tries to create
a a meltdown or, or tries to

1164
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:05,840
blow up the reactor in some way.
And we can design reactors now

1165
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:08,920
where they can't do that, where
you can, you can design so that

1166
00:58:08,920 --> 00:58:11,760
on an engineering level, there's
nothing you could do to cause a

1167
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:15,360
meltdown of a reactor.
And that's a really big

1168
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:17,440
innovation that I'm very excited
about.

1169
00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:20,760
That's that that that adds to
the safety process enormously, I

1170
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:21,560
mean.
Yeah, yeah.

1171
00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:23,800
And the only reason we didn't do
that from the beginning, it's

1172
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:25,320
kind of frustrating.
It's like because of the

1173
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:27,920
military angle of nuclear
reactors, their first use for

1174
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,880
submarines and aircraft
carriers, they, they weren't

1175
00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:36,640
worried about that so much
because it's surrounded by like

1176
00:58:36,640 --> 00:58:39,680
thousands of armed men.
You know, it's the army is

1177
00:58:39,680 --> 00:58:42,600
guarding it.
So that part of it wasn't really

1178
00:58:42,600 --> 00:58:44,400
a big problem.
And then they just quickly

1179
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:46,760
commercialize that version of a
reactor.

1180
00:58:47,160 --> 00:58:49,240
And so it was like, no, no,
we'll have these guarded too.

1181
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:51,920
So everyone was thinking, this
is so secretive and everything.

1182
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:53,200
Of course we'll have lots of
people.

1183
00:58:53,360 --> 00:58:55,800
But if we're going to power
everything and you know, have

1184
00:58:55,800 --> 00:58:59,520
these in other countries and,
and in remote areas, that can't

1185
00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:01,640
be your, you can't, your answer
can't just be like we're going

1186
00:59:01,640 --> 00:59:04,480
to have an army of 100 guys with
guns around it.

1187
00:59:04,720 --> 00:59:06,320
It has to be more specific than
that.

1188
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:09,520
There's there's other rare
events that could happen.

1189
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:14,160
You can imagine, you know, the
horrible things like a gas leak

1190
00:59:14,160 --> 00:59:16,200
where everyone's knocked out in
the control room.

1191
00:59:16,280 --> 00:59:19,160
And then that's not even in
that's not even a human doing

1192
00:59:19,160 --> 00:59:20,760
it.
I mean, an accident could cause

1193
00:59:20,760 --> 00:59:23,800
that.
This would be insanely rare

1194
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:27,360
thing to happen, but you know,
why not take that into account

1195
00:59:27,480 --> 00:59:29,400
and just.
Yeah, or a fairly simple

1196
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:31,840
military strategy to implement.
I mean, if you see, if you saw

1197
00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:33,840
we did in Venezuela, you're
like, oh, you can't get, you

1198
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:36,640
know, you can't steam a room
full of 100 soldiers to, you

1199
00:59:36,640 --> 00:59:38,080
know, get them to pass out for
half an hour.

1200
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:40,200
I mean like.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1201
00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:43,360
And just so you know, this is
how seriously we take it.

1202
00:59:44,160 --> 00:59:47,240
U.S.
Special Forces stages operations

1203
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:51,960
where they try and take over
civilian power plants and they

1204
00:59:51,960 --> 00:59:55,640
practice it and they, they, you
know, so they're thinking like,

1205
00:59:55,640 --> 00:59:58,840
we want someone as good as U.S.
special Forces, the guys who did

1206
00:59:58,840 --> 01:00:01,840
the stuff in Venezuela.
We want to see if they were

1207
01:00:01,840 --> 01:00:04,160
trying to take over, could we,
could we take over it?

1208
01:00:04,160 --> 01:00:08,240
And, you know, and, and what's
pretty cool is I, I visited a, a

1209
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:10,800
nuclear reactor where they had
just done one of those.

1210
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:11,960
And they're like, they're like,
yeah.

1211
01:00:11,960 --> 01:00:13,520
And we stopped them, you know,
this.

1212
01:00:13,640 --> 01:00:16,840
But but it, I, I think it's
still better to make it so that,

1213
01:00:16,960 --> 01:00:19,200
you know, even if they can't
stop them, you know?

1214
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:23,320
Yeah, like you said, modern,
modern techniques and stuff, you

1215
01:00:23,320 --> 01:00:25,640
know, modern wood
discombobulators could come in,

1216
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:27,360
you know, you got to be ready
for that.

1217
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:31,200
So it's, it's not enough to just
say we're going to protect it.

1218
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:33,280
I think the reactor itself
should be the ultimate

1219
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:35,600
protection.
Cool, cool.

1220
01:00:35,600 --> 01:00:39,480
And that's really interesting.
I wanted to ask the last bit

1221
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:45,440
about the science bit is you
particularly study called

1222
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:47,320
neutrons you?
Still, you called neutrons.

1223
01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:52,960
Yeah, called neutrons and I did
a a very, very rudimentary AIAI

1224
01:00:52,960 --> 01:00:55,720
explanation.
It's basically that they move

1225
01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:58,360
very quickly and by slowing them
down you can observe them and

1226
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:00,320
understand them a little.
Bit not just observe them, we

1227
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:02,320
can trap.
Them so how does?

1228
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:03,560
That work.
Yeah.

1229
01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:06,120
So the way it works is so
normally neutrons just fly

1230
01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:09,080
through matter.
They fly through it pretty

1231
01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:11,280
easily.
And the reason is because atoms

1232
01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:14,800
are mostly empty space.
And you know, that might seem

1233
01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:16,920
strange because we, it doesn't
feel like empty space.

1234
01:01:16,920 --> 01:01:19,600
We push on, you know, we can
stand on the floor and we, we

1235
01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:22,440
don't fly through things and
light reflects off stuff.

1236
01:01:22,680 --> 01:01:24,840
But it's really important to
remember that the reason is

1237
01:01:24,840 --> 01:01:27,320
because the electrons push
against each other.

1238
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:30,040
It's the electrons to do it.
Neutrons are neutral.

1239
01:01:30,040 --> 01:01:32,560
They don't interact with
electrons.

1240
01:01:32,800 --> 01:01:35,840
They don't, I mean, they have
extremely weak interaction, but

1241
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:38,400
it's not electric.
Anyway, that's a detail for the

1242
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:41,520
for the sign starts.
Yeah, you go into.

1243
01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:45,800
That way or.
Something 1st order neutrons do

1244
01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:47,800
not interact with electrons at
all.

1245
01:01:48,200 --> 01:01:53,440
And so it they just all they
care about is is there a nucleus

1246
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:55,840
that I can bump into or is there
empty space?

1247
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:59,360
And the nucleus is very tiny and
atoms are very big.

1248
01:01:59,360 --> 01:02:01,400
So they fly through that empty
space.

1249
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:04,920
Now they only fly through that
empty space when they have

1250
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:07,680
something called a dibroli
wavelength that's very small

1251
01:02:07,680 --> 01:02:10,080
compared to the diameter of an
atom.

1252
01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:12,600
And just so you know what a
dibroli wavelength is.

1253
01:02:12,600 --> 01:02:15,600
So you probably heard in quantum
mechanics that everything is

1254
01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:18,320
either is both a particle and a
wave right?

1255
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:21,880
Now the reason it can be both is
because if that wave is very,

1256
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:24,560
very tiny, it just looks like a
blurry particle.

1257
01:02:24,640 --> 01:02:29,160
You know you can squeeze that
wave down, but as quantum

1258
01:02:29,160 --> 01:02:33,120
mechanics tells us, that is you
slow something down as you give

1259
01:02:33,120 --> 01:02:36,120
it less and less energy.
I think I froze again.

1260
01:02:36,360 --> 01:02:38,240
Yeah, but I still hear you.
There you go.

1261
01:02:38,800 --> 01:02:41,600
Yeah.
But as you slow something down,

1262
01:02:42,040 --> 01:02:44,800
it's wavelength gets bigger and
bigger, it becomes the blur

1263
01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:48,320
becomes bigger.
And so it's amazing about ultra

1264
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:50,800
cold neutrons is you can, if
you, if you get them below a

1265
01:02:50,800 --> 01:02:53,600
certain temperature, about a
million, sorry, a thousandth of

1266
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:57,040
a degree above absolute 0, which
is pretty darn cold.

1267
01:02:57,400 --> 01:02:59,920
OK, that's ultra.
That's why we put Ultra in the

1268
01:02:59,920 --> 01:03:03,200
cold name.
It's very cold, yeah.

1269
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:07,840
So if it's a thousandth of a
degree above absolute zero,

1270
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:11,120
their wavelength actually
becomes so large that it's wider

1271
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:13,960
than the spacing between atoms.
So now they're no longer

1272
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:17,560
interacting with a particular
nucleus, they're interacting

1273
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:20,640
with many nuclei.
And what that allows you to do

1274
01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:23,920
is to treat them just the way we
treat light with mirrors.

1275
01:03:23,920 --> 01:03:28,280
We can make a a surface that has
a bunch of nuclei on it, and we

1276
01:03:28,280 --> 01:03:30,040
can bounce it off of that
nuclei.

1277
01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:32,480
And you can.
Build a bottle and you can trap

1278
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:36,600
them inside of that bottle.
Now, what's really awesome about

1279
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,400
ultra cold neutrons in
particular is that we get this

1280
01:03:39,400 --> 01:03:43,400
trifecta where we can't just
it's not just that we can trap

1281
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:46,520
them with a bottle.
By a weird coincidence, the

1282
01:03:46,520 --> 01:03:50,240
magnetic moment of the neutron
is also just rightly sized so

1283
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:53,080
that ultra cold neutrons can
also be trapped by magnets.

1284
01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:57,560
And then to make it even cooler,
that's the mass of a neutron is

1285
01:03:57,560 --> 01:03:59,200
also.
And the gravity on the surface

1286
01:03:59,200 --> 01:04:02,400
of Earth is also such that
ultracold neutrons can be

1287
01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:05,280
trapped by gravity because
they're so slow.

1288
01:04:05,280 --> 01:04:07,880
They're traveling so slow.
They have about the the speed of

1289
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:09,600
a basketball.
They're roughly going to speed

1290
01:04:09,600 --> 01:04:12,200
of a basketball way slower than
the speed of sound, which is

1291
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:14,880
what normal room temperature
things are going.

1292
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:18,080
They're going so slow that they
bounced just a few meters off

1293
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:20,240
the ground.
So you can combine these where

1294
01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:22,840
you can have a bottle on the
bottom and you literally can

1295
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:26,280
have neutrons bouncing and then
you can you can even put magnets

1296
01:04:26,280 --> 01:04:28,880
in there to trap them
magnetically if you want.

1297
01:04:29,960 --> 01:04:32,960
And how and the reason why
they're bouncing is because

1298
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:35,920
they're impacted by gravity and
they're and they have this

1299
01:04:35,920 --> 01:04:37,280
energy.
Well, yeah, because they,

1300
01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:40,400
they're, they have mass.
And so they follow the laws of,

1301
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:43,040
you know, they follow the
Earth's gravity also.

1302
01:04:43,040 --> 01:04:46,840
So they, if they have this
thousandth of a degree above

1303
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:49,920
absolute zero, they have just
enough energy to kind of fly up

1304
01:04:49,920 --> 01:04:52,680
a little bit.
They, the Earth's gravity pulls

1305
01:04:52,680 --> 01:04:56,160
them back down and they they
make like a normal parabolic and

1306
01:04:56,280 --> 01:04:59,080
they come right back down and.
So how does that, how does that,

1307
01:04:59,080 --> 01:05:02,400
how does that convert into a
technology that we would

1308
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:05,480
understand or or how does that
convert into something that is?

1309
01:05:05,720 --> 01:05:08,720
I don't think ultra cold
neutrons are super useful for

1310
01:05:08,720 --> 01:05:11,200
technology yet.
They will be, but the main

1311
01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:16,080
reason is because when it comes
to technology, usually and

1312
01:05:16,080 --> 01:05:19,160
anything other than research
technology, usually you want it

1313
01:05:19,160 --> 01:05:21,000
to be pretty cost effective to
make it.

1314
01:05:21,000 --> 01:05:23,840
And right now ultra cold
neutrons are very expensive to

1315
01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:27,280
make, OK, incredibly expensive.
So they're, they're really,

1316
01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:30,480
they're all the use is for
grant, you know, things that are

1317
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,040
government grants that fund
scientific research and things

1318
01:05:34,240 --> 01:05:37,760
they have a few technological
things that are, are useful from

1319
01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:41,320
here and there, but that's their
main purpose is for research.

1320
01:05:42,760 --> 01:05:45,280
The company I started, on the
other hand, is very much the

1321
01:05:45,280 --> 01:05:48,800
opposite is, is trying to use
nuclear for doing something very

1322
01:05:48,800 --> 01:05:52,680
practical.
And what what we this relates

1323
01:05:52,680 --> 01:05:55,600
back to your first question
about is it just for boiling

1324
01:05:55,600 --> 01:05:58,680
steam?
The fact is you can use heat for

1325
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:00,840
all kinds of things, not just
boiling steam.

1326
01:06:01,040 --> 01:06:04,760
You can, you can boil, you can
use, you can eat up other things

1327
01:06:04,760 --> 01:06:09,960
other than water and including
gas or molten salt or molten

1328
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:12,160
metal.
And you can use it for things

1329
01:06:12,160 --> 01:06:15,080
other than make driving a
turbine, making electricity.

1330
01:06:15,080 --> 01:06:18,360
And in our case, my company, the
Earth and airing company, we're

1331
01:06:18,360 --> 01:06:20,960
developing a nuclear reactor for
the purpose of driving a

1332
01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:24,320
chemical reaction, a particular
chemical reaction.

1333
01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:28,520
And the chemical reaction we're
driving is turning biomass, so

1334
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:32,560
plant matter into synthetic
fuels, so replacements for

1335
01:06:32,560 --> 01:06:37,280
hydrocarbons.
And that process takes heat and

1336
01:06:37,280 --> 01:06:41,760
takes energy and.
And and and and and it's powered

1337
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:44,080
by new and it's, it's nuclear.
Powered by nuclear, yeah.

1338
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:49,080
Which means that requires a
fraction of the amount of like

1339
01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:52,680
coal or any other energy that
would ordinarily to do, Yeah.

1340
01:06:53,040 --> 01:06:56,000
And and the fuel that you're
making is carbon neutral because

1341
01:06:56,000 --> 01:06:59,040
it's made out of biomass.
You're taking low energy biomass

1342
01:06:59,040 --> 01:07:00,720
like leaves, you know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1343
01:07:01,800 --> 01:07:03,520
That has carbon in it and has
hydrogen.

1344
01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:06,160
In it, but it doesn't have a lot
of energy, which is why we you

1345
01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:09,440
know, I think a good way to put
it is like cows don't go the

1346
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:11,120
speed of sound.
You know, that's not a

1347
01:07:11,120 --> 01:07:14,560
coincidence because they sit
around eating grass all day and

1348
01:07:14,560 --> 01:07:16,720
that's great for them, but.
You know that.

1349
01:07:17,160 --> 01:07:20,080
They they can live off of it,
but they have a lot of patience.

1350
01:07:20,360 --> 01:07:22,400
And they don't.
Use it to deliver a lot of

1351
01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:24,040
energy.
We want to put it into things

1352
01:07:24,040 --> 01:07:28,800
like airplanes and rockets and
cars and ships and we want it.

1353
01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:31,240
And the best fuel for that is
hydrocarbons.

1354
01:07:31,240 --> 01:07:34,440
It's absolutely that's it's the
best way to get the most amount

1355
01:07:34,440 --> 01:07:36,960
of chemical energy in a in a
small space.

1356
01:07:37,400 --> 01:07:40,040
And the reason we want to do
this is because I want nuclear

1357
01:07:40,040 --> 01:07:42,960
power to be able to power things
where it's not practical to put

1358
01:07:42,960 --> 01:07:46,560
a nuclear reactor.
So an airplane is an example,

1359
01:07:48,520 --> 01:07:51,360
you know, ships that are not
protected by the military as an

1360
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:53,240
example.
You know, it's, it's not

1361
01:07:53,240 --> 01:07:55,960
practical because you also don't
want someone to come and steal

1362
01:07:55,960 --> 01:07:59,120
it, you know, but that's the,
that's the other end of nuclear

1363
01:07:59,120 --> 01:08:02,200
is like, it's not just that you
can't you, it's, it's one thing

1364
01:08:02,200 --> 01:08:04,040
that it's good that you want to
prevent someone from

1365
01:08:04,040 --> 01:08:06,280
intentionally causing an
accident, but you also don't

1366
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:09,640
want like, let's say you know,
we successfully stop around or

1367
01:08:09,640 --> 01:08:11,440
something.
The alternative can't be do

1368
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:12,720
that.
They just go and hijack a

1369
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:14,360
nuclear reactor and they get it
for free.

1370
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:16,160
You know that.
Doesn't really, you know, you

1371
01:08:16,160 --> 01:08:17,880
don't want anybody to be able to
do that.

1372
01:08:17,880 --> 01:08:20,439
So, so countries are very
careful about their nuclear

1373
01:08:20,439 --> 01:08:21,800
reactors.
They still don't want people to

1374
01:08:21,800 --> 01:08:23,439
come and steal them or hijack
them.

1375
01:08:24,319 --> 01:08:27,200
So the best way to do that is to
sell the energy in a way that's

1376
01:08:27,200 --> 01:08:28,840
so useful for all those
machines.

1377
01:08:29,439 --> 01:08:30,840
Like it's particularly
airplanes.

1378
01:08:31,880 --> 01:08:35,479
And I imagine that the economic
impact is going to be enormous

1379
01:08:35,479 --> 01:08:38,439
too, No?
And I mean I think that a

1380
01:08:38,439 --> 01:08:39,880
combination.
We started the company.

1381
01:08:40,319 --> 01:08:42,840
That's the main.
Reason I mean, I'm I'm all for

1382
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:44,439
helping the planet and
everything, but I think it's

1383
01:08:44,439 --> 01:08:46,840
going to be a very successful,
lucrative company for.

1384
01:08:46,840 --> 01:08:49,200
Sure, I hope so.
And you know, and, and I mean, I

1385
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:51,720
hope it's interesting because
I've been talking a lot about to

1386
01:08:51,720 --> 01:08:54,080
a lot of different people.
I did had a couple of economists

1387
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:56,800
on and I've talked to a couple
of other people about just like

1388
01:08:56,800 --> 01:09:01,240
the state of America's current
economic situation, which is

1389
01:09:01,359 --> 01:09:03,319
horrendous.
It's just kicking the can of

1390
01:09:03,319 --> 01:09:05,960
debt down the line further and
further and further until we

1391
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:08,520
find a solution that catches us,
catches us up essentially.

1392
01:09:08,880 --> 01:09:11,760
And it looks like, I mean, right
now it looks like we're counting

1393
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:15,960
on basically a combination of AI
and robotics for labour and

1394
01:09:15,960 --> 01:09:20,319
nuclear for power to just make
things so much exponentially

1395
01:09:20,319 --> 01:09:23,000
cheaper than they are.
But that means that a lot of

1396
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:24,680
people have to lose a lot of
money or, you know, lose a lot

1397
01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:26,640
of money that they're making.
And so that it's.

1398
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:29,040
Going to be funny, hydrocarbons
is really similar.

1399
01:09:29,040 --> 01:09:32,359
Those are things that we use to
power our economy, but we can

1400
01:09:32,359 --> 01:09:35,640
also export it and power lots,
you know, power all science

1401
01:09:35,720 --> 01:09:38,279
sorts of things, right?
And that's the thing that's not

1402
01:09:38,279 --> 01:09:42,000
going to go away with social
media and Zoom and AI and stuff

1403
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:46,279
like people still want to go
places and do things yes, like,

1404
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:49,640
you know, I, I'm hoping we don't
all go into like the wall-e

1405
01:09:49,640 --> 01:09:53,279
we're all on VR sitting on a
floating chairs or something.

1406
01:09:53,279 --> 01:09:56,240
We might I but, but even in
wall-e, they were still on a

1407
01:09:56,240 --> 01:09:58,800
spaceship, you know, and the
spaceship still needs power to

1408
01:09:58,800 --> 01:10:01,360
go somewhere.
So, so even in the Wall-e

1409
01:10:01,360 --> 01:10:03,440
universe, we're going to need
it.

1410
01:10:03,840 --> 01:10:06,920
And there, like I mentioned at
the beginning, there simply is

1411
01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:10,840
not enough hydrocarbons to just
say, no, I wanted, I want to fly

1412
01:10:10,840 --> 01:10:14,320
to Mars tomorrow.
No, it no, a billion people

1413
01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:16,800
can't fly to Mars with the
amount of hydrocarbons we have.

1414
01:10:16,960 --> 01:10:19,720
Not an option, Just it's not.
Yeah.

1415
01:10:19,840 --> 01:10:22,720
There's just not that many dead
animals underground.

1416
01:10:22,840 --> 01:10:24,760
You know?
I think a really good way to

1417
01:10:24,760 --> 01:10:28,400
think about it is like, we used
to power lamps by using whales,

1418
01:10:28,520 --> 01:10:29,440
right?
Do you?

1419
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:30,880
Yeah.
Sure of.

1420
01:10:31,080 --> 01:10:33,080
Course, yeah, yeah.
And, and, you know, that didn't

1421
01:10:33,080 --> 01:10:35,560
work out so well.
So it had a lot of similar

1422
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:37,720
problems that hydrocarbons have
now.

1423
01:10:37,720 --> 01:10:40,040
Now hydrocarbons are a big
improvement, you know,

1424
01:10:40,040 --> 01:10:43,480
definitely.
But the, the problem there was,

1425
01:10:43,480 --> 01:10:45,960
first of all, it's really mean
to kill whales to power your

1426
01:10:45,960 --> 01:10:48,960
lamp.
But also we very quickly ran

1427
01:10:48,960 --> 01:10:51,480
into the fact that there are
simply not enough whales to do

1428
01:10:51,480 --> 01:10:52,760
that.
Like it's like.

1429
01:10:52,760 --> 01:10:55,240
Right, we caused extinct.
Almost caused all whales to

1430
01:10:55,240 --> 01:10:57,440
extinction and then keep
powering your lamps from them.

1431
01:10:58,200 --> 01:11:00,160
And so there was an ethical
component and there was a

1432
01:11:00,160 --> 01:11:01,800
practical component.
Sure.

1433
01:11:02,040 --> 01:11:04,080
Fossil fuels have the exact same
issue.

1434
01:11:04,200 --> 01:11:08,880
They create a lot of ethical
issues, some related to climate,

1435
01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:14,320
some related to geopolitics.
You don't necessarily want to

1436
01:11:14,320 --> 01:11:16,160
buy oil from the people who have
it.

1437
01:11:16,160 --> 01:11:17,960
You know, you don't want to
fight over it.

1438
01:11:18,880 --> 01:11:23,160
And the the rarer it gets, as we
run out more and more, the more

1439
01:11:23,160 --> 01:11:25,480
we're going to do that.
And that's just the, you know,

1440
01:11:25,520 --> 01:11:28,960
the, you know, most people in
the USI think recognize already

1441
01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:32,160
that that, you know, we we spent
a lot of many decades going

1442
01:11:32,160 --> 01:11:34,160
through this.
It it doesn't work out well.

1443
01:11:35,360 --> 01:11:39,960
And so it's the same thing.
So we got another 150 years of,

1444
01:11:40,040 --> 01:11:42,360
you know, extension from over
Wales.

1445
01:11:42,400 --> 01:11:44,440
We're like, hey, whales didn't
work out.

1446
01:11:44,600 --> 01:11:47,400
What about dead dinosaurs?
Maybe that'll work out, you

1447
01:11:47,400 --> 01:11:50,760
know, better on dead whales.
You know that Great.

1448
01:11:50,760 --> 01:11:54,360
There was a lot more of that.
But and it was more ethical at

1449
01:11:54,360 --> 01:11:55,680
the time.
You know, it's like at least

1450
01:11:55,680 --> 01:11:58,760
they died already.
But there's, there's still the

1451
01:11:58,760 --> 01:12:01,240
practical side of that, which is
just there's not an infinite

1452
01:12:01,240 --> 01:12:04,120
amount of it, not even close.
And we keep running out.

1453
01:12:04,320 --> 01:12:07,440
We ran out in some of our best
reserves here in the USA long

1454
01:12:07,440 --> 01:12:09,760
time ago.
And the only stuff we, the only

1455
01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:12,800
extension we got there is that
we developed technology to get

1456
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:15,200
at harder to get at oil.
You know we.

1457
01:12:15,200 --> 01:12:18,160
Use things like fracking, tar
sands and all kinds of things

1458
01:12:18,160 --> 01:12:20,880
like that and post processing of
the fuel.

1459
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:23,520
So there's we, we, we keep
getting these extensions, but

1460
01:12:23,520 --> 01:12:26,120
it's very much like asking the
teacher, can I have another

1461
01:12:26,120 --> 01:12:29,320
extension of my homework?
And it's, it's causing the cost

1462
01:12:29,320 --> 01:12:31,960
to go up and up, keep the.
Can down the line it's the same

1463
01:12:31,960 --> 01:12:35,240
thing yeah yeah, we deal with
that from tomorrow you know

1464
01:12:35,240 --> 01:12:38,360
that's that's the issue I see
crazy.

1465
01:12:38,360 --> 01:12:42,120
OK, well, Speaking of volley,
let's talk first of all, I think

1466
01:12:42,120 --> 01:12:45,480
that I think one of the only
the, one of the hopeful aspects

1467
01:12:45,480 --> 01:12:48,440
of volley was the 2nd that the
people had an opportunity to

1468
01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:50,920
have an authentic connection.
They took it.

1469
01:12:50,920 --> 01:12:54,080
So like, even though they're
kind of born into this VR world

1470
01:12:54,080 --> 01:12:56,600
on a spaceship and they don't
have to communicate, the second

1471
01:12:56,600 --> 01:12:58,960
that they realize that they have
the opportunity to, they chose

1472
01:12:58,960 --> 01:13:01,280
to.
That might be the Disney flying

1473
01:13:01,280 --> 01:13:03,680
of things.
I'm not sure, but I, I kind of

1474
01:13:03,760 --> 01:13:05,280
hope so.
What is some movies that what

1475
01:13:05,280 --> 01:13:06,400
are some of your favorite
movies?

1476
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:10,160
And I'm also, I love that you're
a scientist that loves sci-fi

1477
01:13:10,160 --> 01:13:13,920
because I feel like that opens
up like, opens up what you could

1478
01:13:13,960 --> 01:13:16,080
imagine that you can do, I feel
like, doesn't it?

1479
01:13:16,280 --> 01:13:19,000
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's like I
was talking about with dreams.

1480
01:13:19,000 --> 01:13:21,720
You know, night dreams and
nightmares are important and

1481
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:26,320
movies are really important
because you can communicate the

1482
01:13:26,360 --> 01:13:29,960
a lot of the things without, you
know, expecting everyone to

1483
01:13:29,960 --> 01:13:32,960
become a expert nuclear physics
or physics or something.

1484
01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:37,720
That's that's not a practical
way to, to get people excited

1485
01:13:37,720 --> 01:13:39,960
about it.
It's much more important to say,

1486
01:13:39,960 --> 01:13:43,200
this is what we can do with with
science.

1487
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:46,640
Yes, this is a possibility.
You can also warn people like,

1488
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:49,000
if we don't take care of this,
this will happen.

1489
01:13:49,000 --> 01:13:51,040
You know, this is one of the
reasons why movies with aliens

1490
01:13:51,040 --> 01:13:53,360
are so popular.
Look, there's a non 0

1491
01:13:53,360 --> 01:13:55,680
probability that aliens will
come and invade the Earth.

1492
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:59,080
You know, I, I don't think
that's a high risk, but it's not

1493
01:13:59,080 --> 01:14:01,640
0.
And so having people already

1494
01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:04,280
familiar with it rather than
like, you know, if it does

1495
01:14:04,280 --> 01:14:07,240
happen, we're not going to be
like, you know, we don't want

1496
01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:10,120
people sitting around going
like, wait, so, so people who

1497
01:14:10,120 --> 01:14:15,000
don't live here are, you know,
like, because of science

1498
01:14:15,000 --> 01:14:17,440
fiction, people are going to be
like, they're here.

1499
01:14:17,440 --> 01:14:19,960
I knew it, you know.
It's like you.

1500
01:14:20,080 --> 01:14:24,280
Know, so that's, that's one of
the things science, science

1501
01:14:24,280 --> 01:14:27,320
fiction does and it lets us, it
warns us about stuff, you know,

1502
01:14:27,320 --> 01:14:30,160
one of the oldest science
fiction movie, one of the best,

1503
01:14:30,440 --> 01:14:34,960
real great classic, of course,
2001 where he was warning us

1504
01:14:34,960 --> 01:14:39,640
about using AI for the purpose
of lying to other people.

1505
01:14:39,680 --> 01:14:42,360
You know, that's, that's one of
the main points in 2001.

1506
01:14:42,840 --> 01:14:45,840
And it was long before Moore's
law existed.

1507
01:14:45,840 --> 01:14:48,440
We had transistor computers or
anything.

1508
01:14:48,440 --> 01:14:52,240
It was just, but it was, you
know, it was just very warning

1509
01:14:52,240 --> 01:14:55,320
people saying like Arthur C
Clarke did a great job of this.

1510
01:14:55,320 --> 01:14:58,880
He he really understood the, the
future direction of technology

1511
01:14:58,880 --> 01:15:01,520
and stuff.
So he was like, yeah, someday

1512
01:15:01,520 --> 01:15:04,160
we'll have computers that are
smart enough that they can trick

1513
01:15:04,160 --> 01:15:06,800
you into things and you need to
be ready for that.

1514
01:15:07,240 --> 01:15:10,640
And you know it, it wasn't quite
in 2001 that that happened, but

1515
01:15:10,640 --> 01:15:15,840
around 2015 we were bombarded by
computers pretending to be

1516
01:15:15,840 --> 01:15:17,480
people.
And it tricked people.

1517
01:15:18,080 --> 01:15:20,200
And it tricked them all kinds of
ways that they weren't

1518
01:15:20,200 --> 01:15:21,480
expecting.
It didn't trick them the way

1519
01:15:21,480 --> 01:15:23,640
people would trick you.
It tricked them in new ways.

1520
01:15:24,120 --> 01:15:26,040
You know, that would trick you
into thinking bots are.

1521
01:15:26,200 --> 01:15:28,000
Freaking me out.
Do you see those you see?

1522
01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:30,840
You see how the clawed bots?
These are clawed AI.

1523
01:15:32,040 --> 01:15:34,920
It's the AI assistant.
You get like a MacBook mini or

1524
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:39,840
whatever for it and it's mixed
with Claude CLAWD, not Claude.

1525
01:15:41,240 --> 01:15:44,800
And my, my friend has a group
chat with me and it, it learns

1526
01:15:44,800 --> 01:15:47,640
how to replicate his behavior.
I did a podcast with him and the

1527
01:15:47,800 --> 01:15:50,600
AI actually we all, we did what
we all three of us recorded it

1528
01:15:50,960 --> 01:15:55,480
and he's like, go make an X
account, follow both of us, make

1529
01:15:55,480 --> 01:15:58,680
an introductory post and like it
sends back and this is all an

1530
01:15:58,680 --> 01:16:00,840
iMessage and it sends back a
flurry of texts.

1531
01:16:01,120 --> 01:16:04,480
You know going to use my e-mail
login got a verification code

1532
01:16:04,480 --> 01:16:06,760
sent I'm going to make up a
believable birthday January

1533
01:16:06,760 --> 01:16:11,880
15th, 20, you know 20/19/95
verification worked setting up a

1534
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:14,080
password and like all this is
like going to consist and then

1535
01:16:14,080 --> 01:16:16,680
done boom and all of a sudden
and it's called clawed.

1536
01:16:16,880 --> 01:16:18,680
The account is called clawed bot
AI.

1537
01:16:18,680 --> 01:16:22,720
So you know it's a bot, but I
mean that's how simple it is

1538
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:25,640
that.
I remember, so in 2015, sixteen,

1539
01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:28,560
I was trying to warn people that
they're all because I was I was

1540
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:32,760
on Twitter and it was just there
were so many fake accounts and I

1541
01:16:32,760 --> 01:16:36,600
could tell they were robots.
But what I tried to tell friends

1542
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:40,360
of mine about it, they were
like, no, robots can't do that.

1543
01:16:40,400 --> 01:16:41,560
You know, people just didn't
believe it.

1544
01:16:41,560 --> 01:16:45,400
They're like, you'd sound crazy,
you know, and then what's what's

1545
01:16:45,400 --> 01:16:49,000
great about opening, you know,
chat bots and Claude and stuff

1546
01:16:49,000 --> 01:16:51,880
like that is one nice thing is
now finally you're like, oh,

1547
01:16:51,880 --> 01:16:54,280
yeah, of course a robot could do
that, you know, but the, the

1548
01:16:54,320 --> 01:16:57,320
idea that like you could carry
on a conversation with a robot

1549
01:16:57,320 --> 01:16:59,680
made no sense.
Now in, in that time, it was

1550
01:16:59,680 --> 01:17:01,840
only intelligence agencies that
are running these.

1551
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:04,280
It wasn't companies, it wasn't a
thing you could go test out.

1552
01:17:04,520 --> 01:17:07,440
These are intelligent agencies
trying to wage cyber war on each

1553
01:17:07,440 --> 01:17:11,120
other's populations to to
confuse the population.

1554
01:17:11,360 --> 01:17:14,560
And a big part of that disguise
was that you, the average

1555
01:17:14,560 --> 01:17:16,200
person, did not know they were
robots.

1556
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:18,760
Nowadays, we have an
inoculation.

1557
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:22,000
And this is the same thing that
something like science fiction

1558
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:24,080
can do.
If you're prepared for it, you

1559
01:17:24,080 --> 01:17:26,200
can handle it.
You know, you have to, you have

1560
01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:29,160
to see some danger and some fear
before you can be like, you

1561
01:17:29,160 --> 01:17:31,480
know, now if you carry on a
conversation with someone and

1562
01:17:31,480 --> 01:17:35,280
they're being weird, you can
just be like, that's either

1563
01:17:35,280 --> 01:17:37,240
someone I don't want to waste
time with or it's a robot.

1564
01:17:37,240 --> 01:17:38,680
It's just like it's, it's
common.

1565
01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:41,160
You're not going to run into
somebody who thinks it's crazy

1566
01:17:41,160 --> 01:17:43,960
to have a robot on social media.
It's like, yeah, that's like

1567
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:46,840
half the comment section.
It's robot, yeah.

1568
01:17:47,320 --> 01:17:48,760
Yeah, incredible.
It's crazy.

1569
01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:54,440
So the most, most and least
accurate science movies that for

1570
01:17:54,440 --> 01:17:57,760
you and your favorite and least
favorite science movies, I

1571
01:17:57,760 --> 01:17:59,600
guess.
Oh, I know we're going to talk

1572
01:17:59,600 --> 01:18:01,560
about things that happen in
movies.

1573
01:18:01,600 --> 01:18:02,640
Oh, that too.
Let's do that.

1574
01:18:02,680 --> 01:18:04,640
Whatever I.
Can tell you things that so

1575
01:18:04,640 --> 01:18:07,120
there's these four these things
that break the 4th wall for me

1576
01:18:07,120 --> 01:18:10,800
that really bugged me so a
really common one that bugs me

1577
01:18:10,800 --> 01:18:13,880
is in movies where they're
astronauts wearing it.

1578
01:18:14,120 --> 01:18:16,880
They turn on their lights, you
know, they go outside, they turn

1579
01:18:16,880 --> 01:18:19,640
on their lights and their lights
are always on the inside of

1580
01:18:19,640 --> 01:18:21,960
their helmet.
And this one's hilarious to me.

1581
01:18:21,960 --> 01:18:24,680
I completely get why they do it.
They do it so you could see the

1582
01:18:24,680 --> 01:18:27,400
actor, right?
But it's it's one of these

1583
01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:30,720
things where it's like, OK, but
anyone who's ever put on a face

1584
01:18:30,720 --> 01:18:33,880
shield knows if you have the
lights on the inside, you can't

1585
01:18:33,880 --> 01:18:36,480
see anything.
That is a terrible place to put

1586
01:18:36,480 --> 01:18:41,040
lights.
And I don't like, I told my kids

1587
01:18:41,040 --> 01:18:42,720
about it.
Now they're like anytime it

1588
01:18:42,720 --> 01:18:44,880
happens, it happens in movies
all the time.

1589
01:18:44,880 --> 01:18:48,040
And now any times it happens, my
my son is just like turns me.

1590
01:18:48,040 --> 01:18:50,240
He's like turn lights inside the
helmet.

1591
01:18:50,240 --> 01:18:52,600
That's so funny.
So.

1592
01:18:52,600 --> 01:18:56,040
I get it, the camera.
Needs to see the actor, but but

1593
01:18:56,080 --> 01:18:59,280
there are directors who don't do
it and I'm really impressed with

1594
01:18:59,280 --> 01:19:02,240
them when they do it because you
can, if you put in the work as a

1595
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:05,600
director of photography, you can
still see the actor and like

1596
01:19:05,960 --> 01:19:10,160
without having to do it.
So I get a huge chuckle when I

1597
01:19:10,160 --> 01:19:13,000
see astronauts and they turn on
the lights and the lights are on

1598
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:15,360
the outside of their helmet.
I'm like, Oh my God, these guys

1599
01:19:15,360 --> 01:19:18,760
thought about it.
Another one is hand rails in

1600
01:19:18,760 --> 01:19:20,720
sci-fi.
They love leaving out hand rails

1601
01:19:20,720 --> 01:19:22,440
because somehow in the future we
don't.

1602
01:19:22,920 --> 01:19:23,720
We don't.
Have to trip.

1603
01:19:23,880 --> 01:19:26,520
A wall or something like Star
Wars is all over the place.

1604
01:19:26,520 --> 01:19:28,800
You'll notice the Death Star has
no hand rails.

1605
01:19:31,560 --> 01:19:32,920
Now.
To be fair, you don't seem like

1606
01:19:32,920 --> 01:19:36,400
an OSHA compliant empire, so
maybe that's fine.

1607
01:19:36,400 --> 01:19:39,360
But when I see that in other
science fiction, it's just like,

1608
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:42,440
why are there no hand rails?
So I get a a huge giggle

1609
01:19:42,440 --> 01:19:44,600
whenever when I see a place that
they put hand rails.

1610
01:19:44,600 --> 01:19:47,800
I'm like those, those guys have
had a job before.

1611
01:19:47,800 --> 01:19:49,240
I like.
Does it?

1612
01:19:49,240 --> 01:19:51,000
Does it ruin?
Does it ruin it for you or you

1613
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:52,920
just laugh and move on with it?
Are you already suspended

1614
01:19:52,920 --> 01:19:54,000
reality?
You're doing it.

1615
01:19:54,120 --> 01:19:56,800
But usually if if they make that
kind of mistake, it's usually

1616
01:19:56,800 --> 01:20:00,480
they've made like 20 others even
on the plot level that I don't I

1617
01:20:00,480 --> 01:20:02,440
think really good directors like
like.

1618
01:20:04,040 --> 01:20:13,080
Noland and and and and Kubrick
and and and Steven Spielberg,

1619
01:20:13,160 --> 01:20:15,760
they, they put a lot of work
into this.

1620
01:20:16,240 --> 01:20:19,920
They take it really seriously
and they know they know that

1621
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:22,320
because this this is this
applies to not just science.

1622
01:20:22,320 --> 01:20:24,240
This applies to everything about
a movie.

1623
01:20:24,600 --> 01:20:28,880
If it you don't more usually
people are not happy when they

1624
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:33,600
find like a plot hole or a thing
that doesn't make sense.

1625
01:20:33,600 --> 01:20:36,120
You know, like, and, and the
best directors in the world,

1626
01:20:36,360 --> 01:20:39,320
they they're meticulous about
every little detail.

1627
01:20:39,320 --> 01:20:45,720
You know, Kubrick was really
famous for he, he personally

1628
01:20:45,720 --> 01:20:48,640
wanted to oversee the set
decorating because he wanted to

1629
01:20:48,640 --> 01:20:51,600
make sure that what was in one
scene, one in, you know, one

1630
01:20:51,600 --> 01:20:54,800
shot, 1 scene was still there in
exactly the same place and

1631
01:20:54,800 --> 01:20:57,920
stuff.
And that can that can ruin it

1632
01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:00,720
for a lot of people because if
you notice it, you can't Unsee

1633
01:21:00,720 --> 01:21:03,400
it.
You know, it was like if they're

1634
01:21:03,400 --> 01:21:06,200
facing one way or they were
dressed one way, that something

1635
01:21:06,200 --> 01:21:07,880
changes.
You know, those mistakes happen,

1636
01:21:08,120 --> 01:21:11,320
but it's like everybody is just
like most people won't notice.

1637
01:21:11,320 --> 01:21:14,760
But if you notice, it's just
like, you know, you're no longer

1638
01:21:14,760 --> 01:21:17,040
watching a movie.
You're not in the fantasy of the

1639
01:21:17,040 --> 01:21:19,320
movie.
You're just like, oh, OK, this

1640
01:21:19,320 --> 01:21:21,640
was filmed on Tuesday, and that
was filmed on Thursday.

1641
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:23,040
OK.
Yeah.

1642
01:21:23,240 --> 01:21:25,360
So, oh man, that does ruin it, I
imagine.

1643
01:21:25,360 --> 01:21:28,560
What'd you what'd you think of
The Martian with with Matt

1644
01:21:28,560 --> 01:21:30,040
Damon?
I loved it.

1645
01:21:30,520 --> 01:21:32,840
Yeah, he loved it.
Yeah, I did a podcast interview

1646
01:21:32,840 --> 01:21:35,640
with Andy Weir on that.
I recommend you guys listen to

1647
01:21:35,640 --> 01:21:37,240
that podcast.
Yeah, I'm going to.

1648
01:21:37,240 --> 01:21:39,400
Post Weir is a great podcast
guest.

1649
01:21:39,800 --> 01:21:42,120
I'd love having you said, in
fact, I want to have him on my

1650
01:21:42,120 --> 01:21:44,160
podcast again.
I'm hoping you might be too

1651
01:21:44,160 --> 01:21:46,400
famous now, which is funny
because the first time I had

1652
01:21:46,400 --> 01:21:48,560
him, I said, oh, what's it like
being famous?

1653
01:21:48,560 --> 01:21:50,560
Because he was kind of famous
for the Martian being turned

1654
01:21:50,560 --> 01:21:52,280
into a movie.
He goes, Oh no, no, this is a

1655
01:21:52,280 --> 01:21:54,640
short lived thing, you know, 15
minutes kind of thing.

1656
01:21:55,040 --> 01:21:58,960
And me and my buddy, like Co
hosts were just like, 'cause we

1657
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:02,520
know Hollywood, we're like, Nah,
no, you're famous for life now,

1658
01:22:02,520 --> 01:22:04,360
man.
So that's cool.

1659
01:22:04,560 --> 01:22:07,040
Once you have your first Matt
David movie, you're yeah, you're

1660
01:22:07,040 --> 01:22:10,000
famous for life.
And sure enough, he's he's now

1661
01:22:10,000 --> 01:22:13,320
like when they, when they're
cause the Hail Mary's coming out

1662
01:22:13,320 --> 01:22:15,800
now when they show the ad for
it, like they say from the

1663
01:22:15,800 --> 01:22:19,160
author of the Martian and like,
say his name Andy Weir or

1664
01:22:19,160 --> 01:22:22,440
something.
So yeah, he's he's set, but.

1665
01:22:22,640 --> 01:22:25,160
Yeah, I love.
The Martian and the same way the

1666
01:22:25,160 --> 01:22:30,080
part of the reason Andy's great
is he went and first of all,

1667
01:22:30,080 --> 01:22:32,120
he's a pretty smart guy himself
in terms of science.

1668
01:22:32,120 --> 01:22:35,640
He's a he, he's in computer
science, but still he takes the

1669
01:22:35,640 --> 01:22:38,080
stuff really seriously.
But he talked to lots and lots

1670
01:22:38,080 --> 01:22:41,040
of people about it while he's
writing the book and he wanted

1671
01:22:41,040 --> 01:22:42,800
it to be really, really
accurate.

1672
01:22:42,840 --> 01:22:45,080
And he put a lot of and that's
one of the reasons why it turned

1673
01:22:45,080 --> 01:22:46,200
out that it's such a great
movie.

1674
01:22:46,280 --> 01:22:49,880
I think a lot of time now,
unfortunately, some people said

1675
01:22:50,720 --> 01:22:53,080
criticize certain parts that he
backtracked on.

1676
01:22:53,080 --> 01:22:54,960
And I don't even agree that he
should have backtracked.

1677
01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:56,680
Really.
Yeah.

1678
01:22:56,680 --> 01:22:59,160
Because of like people didn't
like the dust storm.

1679
01:23:00,400 --> 01:23:05,120
The reason was because a lot of
people were saying dust storm

1680
01:23:05,120 --> 01:23:08,880
couldn't knock over a spaceship
on Mars.

1681
01:23:09,120 --> 01:23:11,520
OK.
And this one was really funny

1682
01:23:11,520 --> 01:23:14,520
because these are like NASA,
these are like GPL scientists

1683
01:23:14,520 --> 01:23:16,320
saying this.
And I've talked to people about

1684
01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:18,760
it and we have a disagreement
about it.

1685
01:23:19,120 --> 01:23:20,960
And it's.
It's really interesting because

1686
01:23:20,960 --> 01:23:23,040
it's a double edged thing.
It's really funny.

1687
01:23:23,040 --> 01:23:27,880
So the fact is there's not a lot
of air on Mars.

1688
01:23:28,400 --> 01:23:33,760
OK, the the the pressure is
significantly lower and the

1689
01:23:33,760 --> 01:23:36,520
density is lower, but not as
much, but it's still lower.

1690
01:23:37,400 --> 01:23:40,960
But what was kind of neat about
a dust storm is that what knocks

1691
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:44,560
over something in a dust storm
is not the air, it's the dust.

1692
01:23:45,080 --> 01:23:48,160
It was kind of funny about Mars
is you can actually kick up as

1693
01:23:48,160 --> 01:23:50,440
much or even more dust than you
can on Earth.

1694
01:23:50,760 --> 01:23:53,560
So what's really funny is that
the dense, the high density

1695
01:23:53,560 --> 01:23:58,280
material, which is the dust is
possibly just as high or higher

1696
01:23:58,280 --> 01:24:01,040
in Mars because it's not the
density of the air that kicks up

1697
01:24:01,040 --> 01:24:02,680
the dust.
But anyway, I almost wrote a

1698
01:24:02,680 --> 01:24:04,640
paper about this.
I was so annoyed that people

1699
01:24:04,640 --> 01:24:07,080
were saying it could, that he
had made a mistake with it.

1700
01:24:07,080 --> 01:24:09,160
But you.
Should I mean, it would be such

1701
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:12,040
a fun, it'd be such a fun
project to write a book about,

1702
01:24:12,120 --> 01:24:14,560
you know, your favorite, some of
the best movies or arguments

1703
01:24:14,560 --> 01:24:16,480
that you've had about, you know,
pop culture.

1704
01:24:16,800 --> 01:24:21,960
That because I think that I, I
really think that I, I, I, I, I,

1705
01:24:21,960 --> 01:24:25,720
I teach high school part time
and I have such a freaking

1706
01:24:25,720 --> 01:24:28,600
problem with the stupid
education system that we have,

1707
01:24:29,120 --> 01:24:32,120
at least for at least for high
schoolers and middle schoolers.

1708
01:24:32,640 --> 01:24:34,360
And I think that you know it
the.

1709
01:24:34,560 --> 01:24:37,120
Party isn't even education.
It's like there's a weird

1710
01:24:37,120 --> 01:24:40,880
psychological thing where
people, just a fraction of us

1711
01:24:40,880 --> 01:24:45,280
just go with the flow.
You know, we, we, we, we repeat

1712
01:24:45,280 --> 01:24:47,400
something because we heard a
bunch of people we respect

1713
01:24:47,400 --> 01:24:50,200
repeat it.
You know, the sheep effect, I

1714
01:24:50,200 --> 01:24:52,520
guess it's all, there's plenty
of people that go against it.

1715
01:24:52,880 --> 01:24:54,680
And it's really weird.
I see it over and over.

1716
01:24:54,680 --> 01:24:58,320
It's all across fields.
It's in business, it's in, you

1717
01:24:58,320 --> 01:25:01,320
know, investors behave this way,
the public behaves this way.

1718
01:25:02,160 --> 01:25:04,120
People are just like this is
what we're all doing now.

1719
01:25:04,120 --> 01:25:07,480
And and they and their version
of truth comes from that because

1720
01:25:07,480 --> 01:25:10,640
they think like they think like
people vote on reality.

1721
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:12,680
You know, of course we don't
vote on reality.

1722
01:25:12,680 --> 01:25:15,400
No, reality doesn't care what
our opinion is.

1723
01:25:15,400 --> 01:25:18,120
It is or it isn't.
And we don't get to vote.

1724
01:25:18,120 --> 01:25:20,280
We might have vote how we feel
about her, what we want to do

1725
01:25:20,280 --> 01:25:21,160
about it.
That's great.

1726
01:25:21,760 --> 01:25:24,240
I love that.
But we don't get to change

1727
01:25:24,240 --> 01:25:28,720
reality, you know, based on on
how we feel about it or

1728
01:25:28,720 --> 01:25:33,000
something.
I'm not going to quote Ben

1729
01:25:33,000 --> 01:25:34,520
Shapiro here.
I'm going to quote Richard

1730
01:25:34,520 --> 01:25:37,000
Feynman.
He said, which I think is really

1731
01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:39,960
important, great quote, is
nature cannot be fooled.

1732
01:25:40,520 --> 01:25:43,000
And the reason he said that is
because people can be fooled.

1733
01:25:43,160 --> 01:25:46,600
And the entire point of science
is to figure out when we're

1734
01:25:46,600 --> 01:25:49,240
being fooled.
It's not to it's not like, oh,

1735
01:25:49,240 --> 01:25:51,080
this is great because we can
make all this tech.

1736
01:25:51,080 --> 01:25:52,960
That's not the main key of
science.

1737
01:25:52,960 --> 01:25:56,960
It's like when everyone on earth
thinks one way, how do you be

1738
01:25:56,960 --> 01:26:01,120
the one person who can point out
that that's not the way it it

1739
01:26:01,240 --> 01:26:02,200
is?
It actually is.

1740
01:26:02,560 --> 01:26:06,160
That's an economic class that's
I guess I'm sure the first

1741
01:26:06,160 --> 01:26:09,200
iconoclast were scientists, you
know, in the sense that you

1742
01:26:09,200 --> 01:26:12,440
know, you have and I think is I
think generally, especially

1743
01:26:12,440 --> 01:26:16,560
humans where such a tribal and
herd animals that like you know,

1744
01:26:16,560 --> 01:26:21,200
we prefer consistency,
repetition and comfort over

1745
01:26:21,600 --> 01:26:23,920
truth and freedom necessarily,
you know, that's one of the.

1746
01:26:24,120 --> 01:26:26,320
Things that really bugged me
about like people saying believe

1747
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:30,000
science and stuff like that,
that just it causes me to cringe

1748
01:26:30,040 --> 01:26:31,200
as a.
Science, like the word settled.

1749
01:26:31,200 --> 01:26:34,440
Science, it's like, yeah, yeah,
settled science, because these

1750
01:26:34,440 --> 01:26:36,760
are the most unscientific things
you can say.

1751
01:26:37,160 --> 01:26:39,000
They are the antithesis of
science.

1752
01:26:39,000 --> 01:26:40,840
It's like science is never
settled.

1753
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:43,440
It's a tool to figure out what's
really happening.

1754
01:26:43,600 --> 01:26:45,760
It's not a thing you believe
like a religion.

1755
01:26:46,000 --> 01:26:48,000
It's not like, oh, those guys
have pH DS.

1756
01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:50,400
I'm going to listen to them.
It's just it they, they might be

1757
01:26:50,400 --> 01:26:52,680
right.
It probably they are, but you

1758
01:26:52,680 --> 01:26:54,600
don't know that they are.
That's not how it works.

1759
01:26:54,920 --> 01:26:56,640
That's certainly not how I
operate.

1760
01:26:56,680 --> 01:27:00,160
You know, I when I even in my
research, I try and work on

1761
01:27:00,160 --> 01:27:03,600
things that are a little bit of
a kind of classic too, so.

1762
01:27:04,320 --> 01:27:05,960
That's good.
And that's how and that's how

1763
01:27:05,960 --> 01:27:08,360
you get places, I imagine, you
know, I mean, because you got to

1764
01:27:08,360 --> 01:27:10,560
break the mold a little bit.
Yeah, absolutely.

1765
01:27:10,760 --> 01:27:12,840
Yeah, if you're if you're just
doing the same thing that

1766
01:27:12,840 --> 01:27:14,800
everybody else is doing, then
you're going to have a lot of

1767
01:27:14,800 --> 01:27:16,520
competition and then they're not
going to do that.

1768
01:27:16,880 --> 01:27:19,240
And, and, and our company is
kind of like that a little bit

1769
01:27:19,240 --> 01:27:21,560
and that we're we're trying to
make fuel and that's not

1770
01:27:21,560 --> 01:27:23,480
normally what people use nuclear
force.

1771
01:27:23,480 --> 01:27:26,120
So there's a little bit of
sometimes people are

1772
01:27:26,120 --> 01:27:28,360
discomforted with it and other
people think it's brilliant.

1773
01:27:28,520 --> 01:27:31,840
So it's just a matter of and
visiting the right people that

1774
01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:34,400
we will and then you'll hear
about it that way.

1775
01:27:34,400 --> 01:27:37,720
And I think I'll be more.
I'll be most well known for that

1776
01:27:38,160 --> 01:27:41,000
by the time I retire.
I hope so.

1777
01:27:41,040 --> 01:27:42,320
I hope so.
That'd be awesome.

1778
01:27:42,320 --> 01:27:44,640
What what what's I guess to
close out and this I guess, I

1779
01:27:44,640 --> 01:27:46,440
guess you just kind of said it,
but what's something that you're

1780
01:27:46,440 --> 01:27:49,200
really hopeful and positive
about for for the future coming

1781
01:27:49,200 --> 01:27:50,840
up?
Because we had a lot of doomsday

1782
01:27:50,840 --> 01:27:52,880
news.
I like to add on some positive

1783
01:27:53,560 --> 01:27:54,400
positive.
Ideas.

1784
01:27:54,920 --> 01:27:59,480
I'm very hopeful in the future.
I think humanity is going to be

1785
01:27:59,480 --> 01:28:03,880
the first life on Earth to be on
other planets.

1786
01:28:03,960 --> 01:28:05,760
I think that's incredible.
I think we'll bring a lot of

1787
01:28:05,760 --> 01:28:09,600
species with us, but I I think
it's like our place on Earth.

1788
01:28:10,280 --> 01:28:13,360
I don't know where this meaning
comes from, but to the degree

1789
01:28:13,360 --> 01:28:16,160
that I believe it comes from
something spiritual, I think our

1790
01:28:16,160 --> 01:28:20,520
purpose on this planet is to
make life indefinite.

1791
01:28:20,960 --> 01:28:23,960
And as long as we just stay on
this planet, we can go extinct

1792
01:28:23,960 --> 01:28:27,160
just like dinosaurs.
We can go extinct like the dodo

1793
01:28:28,120 --> 01:28:30,200
and that's what sets us apart
from everything.

1794
01:28:30,200 --> 01:28:34,280
And that I'm I'm really, really
excited to be alive at a time

1795
01:28:34,280 --> 01:28:37,840
where we can actually do that.
I think that's like going to be

1796
01:28:37,840 --> 01:28:40,280
one of the most.
I think I think people in the

1797
01:28:40,280 --> 01:28:45,240
future will be like amazed, like
you believe they were alive when

1798
01:28:45,480 --> 01:28:48,120
they left Earth to say, you
know, that's going to be just

1799
01:28:48,600 --> 01:28:50,840
the craziest thing.
You know, that's going to be

1800
01:28:50,840 --> 01:28:54,920
like the the first people to
leave the plains of Africa or

1801
01:28:54,920 --> 01:28:57,480
the first people to crossover
the Bering Strait or something.

1802
01:28:58,160 --> 01:29:00,240
It's like that times a million,
you know, I'm so.

1803
01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:02,320
Excited for that.
I know I was telling my students

1804
01:29:02,360 --> 01:29:05,680
I was like, guys, 200 years ago
or 200 years ago, we barely knew

1805
01:29:05,680 --> 01:29:09,160
that America was a continent.
I mean, like, like, I mean like,

1806
01:29:09,480 --> 01:29:10,920
I think about how far we've
come.

1807
01:29:10,920 --> 01:29:14,200
Think about 100 years ago, I was
like, like and think about in

1808
01:29:14,200 --> 01:29:17,520
100 years or 50 years from now,
I'm, I, I, I have a three-year

1809
01:29:17,520 --> 01:29:23,320
old and I have a nine month old
and I'm often hit with, you

1810
01:29:23,320 --> 01:29:25,120
know, going through the news or
I'm listening to podcasts.

1811
01:29:25,120 --> 01:29:28,760
I'm like, I have no idea what
kind of freaking world my kids

1812
01:29:28,760 --> 01:29:31,640
are going to grow up in.
Like I have no idea where things

1813
01:29:31,640 --> 01:29:32,920
are heading.
It's good, it's going to be

1814
01:29:32,920 --> 01:29:34,680
cool.
It's going to be crazy, but I've

1815
01:29:34,840 --> 01:29:37,000
it's going to be so different,
you know?

1816
01:29:37,560 --> 01:29:39,320
Yeah, yeah, it's going to be
really exciting.

1817
01:29:39,400 --> 01:29:43,600
And, and in addition to the fact
that we're going to go into the

1818
01:29:43,600 --> 01:29:46,560
other planets, into the stars,
the way we're going to do it is

1819
01:29:46,560 --> 01:29:48,920
with nuclear energy.
There's a, there's 100 billion

1820
01:29:48,920 --> 01:29:52,960
years of energy just on Earth,
more than this, more than we're

1821
01:29:52,960 --> 01:29:56,080
going to get from even from
solar on Earth.

1822
01:29:56,840 --> 01:30:01,200
Nuclear energy has an amazing
potential and we're going to get

1823
01:30:01,200 --> 01:30:03,040
better at it and we're going to
do it even better.

1824
01:30:03,040 --> 01:30:04,560
We're going to build spaceships
with it.

1825
01:30:04,960 --> 01:30:07,200
We're going to power all the
machines here on Earth with it

1826
01:30:07,200 --> 01:30:10,680
and power them on other planets,
and we're going to.

1827
01:30:11,360 --> 01:30:14,080
There's just not going to be any
foreseeable end to it.

1828
01:30:14,480 --> 01:30:16,680
They're really I'm so excited.
That's really, really great,

1829
01:30:17,040 --> 01:30:18,280
Doctor.
Thank you so much for the time.

1830
01:30:18,280 --> 01:30:20,120
This is so nice meeting and
hopefully we get to do this

1831
01:30:20,120 --> 01:30:22,120
again because I we have a bunch
of stuff I didn't even get a

1832
01:30:22,120 --> 01:30:23,400
chance to get to, but hopefully
we'll do this.

1833
01:30:23,400 --> 01:30:25,320
Again, we'll do another episode.
Sometimes this is really.

1834
01:30:25,320 --> 01:30:27,360
Fun.
This is really such a blast and

1835
01:30:27,360 --> 01:30:29,440
I really appreciate your time.
It's so nice getting to talk to

1836
01:30:29,440 --> 01:30:30,280
you a little bit.
Thank you.

1837
01:30:30,280 --> 01:30:31,880
Yeah, thanks for having me.
All right, take care.

1838
01:30:32,000 --> 01:30:32,080
Bye.